If there were half of the number of people going to glamis,would the fee go an additional 50%?
Also if you think the fees would, or will come down even if there was 100%compliance you are sadly mistaken.

Also, why is there no stipulation for us campers who only visit ISDRA in the washes? I do not want or need any services.

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If there were half of the number of people going to glamis,would the fee go an additional 50%? Also if you think the fees would, or will come down even if there was 100%compliance you are sadly mistaken. Also, why is there no stipulation for us campers who only visit ISDRA in the washes? I do not want or need any services.

Theoretically, if the number of visitors decreases the amount spent on services decreases so sure, the fee shoud then decrease.

But you're right... even though it's written in the business plan that if there is surplus revenue the fees could go down, it would take tremendous public outcry to make it happen. More likely visitos would be asked what services they'd like to see added and then the money would be budgeted for those improvements. But we've heard all that before.

And the issue of those who camp in places like the washes or Mammoth or some other remote location in the Imperial Dunes not needing services is really only a valid point until that person steps outside of their camp, at which point they are utilizing resources outside their remote location. Riding in the dunes and rolling down a hill might get you some emergency help... that wasn't paid for in your "remote access" pass. Or if you take a ride to a friend's camp and stop at the loo on the way... you didn't pay for that with your remote access pass.

Unless of course, they devise a minimum pass for those services that everyone must buy, and those who camp where there are more services would pay an additional amount from there.

Two things though... what a nightmare to administer that would be, thus raising the fees, and even wash road has expenses... you'd be amazed how many people actually want the wash road to be graded every year. And treated to control the dust!

Vicki

The number of people who want wash road graded has drasticly dropped, after they discovered that once graded it turns into a racetrack. With no dust control, (the fee was supposed to pay for watering the road), camps turned into dust bowls. With no law enforcement, (the fee was supposed to pay for that), people raced up and down the road with no regard for speed limits, finally ending when some poor kid was killed in a head-on with a pickup that was fishtailing down the road, (Thanksgiving 2002).

No, I would bet that the number of people who still want wash road nice and flat has drasticly been reduced.

As for services in the dunes... If you think that your accident that you MIGHT have is going to result in the BLM FUNCO comming to your rescue you are delusional With over 200,000 people at Glamis during T-day, the odds that the one or two emergancy vehicles will find you and help you are astronomical. No, the so-called "services" in the dunes propper (EMT's and LEO's) are nothing more then "feel good" services that has little or no affect for the general duner.
Makes you feel that much better knowing that they are there, though, don't it?
Myself, I'm going to do what I've ALWAYS done, the way I was TAUGHT. I will take care of myself and my family/friends and anyone else I happen across that needs it. My services are FREE.

I wouldn't step inside one of those portible toilets on a bet.

I am one of the people that was helped directly by the rangers in a time of need when I broke my back. This was along gecko road and not a far off place. They got to me within 15 minutes and treated me wonderfully.


However: As a former paid call firefighter, these services are all over the united states for anyone who gets hurt in an accident. If you get in an accident on the freeway, you get an ambulance and firefighters coming to assist you. You do not have to pay a fee, over and above your registration to use the freeway or receive medical help from the Fire Dept.

There is no reason why anyone who pays the registration on their toys needs to pay over and above to use the pulic land set aside for that purpose.

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If you get in an accident on the freeway, you get an ambulance and firefighters coming to assist you. You do not have to pay a fee, over and above your registration to use the freeway or receive medical help from the Fire Dept.

I was in a wreck 5 years ago on a CA secondary road. An ambulance came and took me and my wife to the hospital. They charged us $5,000 for the trip and for the ER doctor to take some Xrays and let us both go within 30 min.

there were charges like $75.00 for putting a board under my wife's neck etc etc.

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QUOTE If you get in an accident on the freeway, you get an ambulance and firefighters coming to assist you. You do not have to pay a fee, over and above your registration to use the freeway or receive medical help from the Fire Dept. I was in a wreck 5 years ago on a CA secondary road. An ambulance came and took me and my wife to the hospital. They charged us $5,000 for the trip and for the ER doctor to take some Xrays and let us both go within 30 min. there were charges like $75.00 for putting a board under my wife's neck etc etc.

*IGNORE MODE ENABLED*

To pay a fee above and beyond what the green sticker charges are supposed to take care of is ridiculous.
My brothers ex-boss decided to go out for a desert ride in the middle of BFE (well take the barstow to vegas route) on his motorcycle. He proceeded to eat crap big time, breaking his rt shoulder, rt hip, rt femur, and rt ankle. He seriously ef'ed himself up. He got on his nextel and two way'd my brother because the cell phone part had no signal. My brother called 911 for him with his bosses gps coordinates. To make a long story short, SB county fire dept flew out the helo to pick his butt up, The cost for the flight was nada,ziltch, complements of the county tax payer. the hospital costs on the other hand were all my brothers ex-bosses.
So if the helo flight (which generally runs 10k easily) was covered by an already existing plan without a supplement fee, why should Glamis be any different?
In my opinion the fee that are being incurred at Glamis are nothing but a revenue generator that puts very little back into the resource but the majority into the payroll coffer.

When I had my street-bike accident it happened literally two blocks from the hosptial. My insurance got hit for $299.00 from the paramedics for "Drugs/supplies". I was also hit up for $284.75 and $75.00 again for "Drugs/supplies". But that was very little compared to the total cost of medical services related to my accident which came out to $36,802.46 of which I was immedately responsibe for $5,002 Co-pay.

EMS is privitatized in some areas...here in Yuma we have Rural-Metro which is a private EMS provider. They don't make their money on the fees for being on call they make it when they respond. EMS is something that can and in many places is billed on a "Per use" basis. Unfortunatly CA has gone so socalist that even the more conservative people sometimes forget this.

Maybe the BLM should charge for medical services, toilet services, road services, and camping pad services. That way VOR would only have to pay a lower fee pay for the general services for expenses of law enforcement and the required office tasks for the ISDRA.

Heck, I can see it now, you drive down the Wash road, but you pay a toll first, a toll for Gecko Rd. and a camping fee for camping on the pad, a fee per bag of trash at the dumpsters and a coin lock at the toilets. Don't forget to charge for search and rescue and bill the injured party for EMT fees.

Here is the biggest gripe I have with all of these unneeded fees. THIS IS PUBLIC LAND! Since when did it become government land that the public must beg and pay to use? Dept of interior (BLM) is there to patrol the areas under their budget (the federal, which the public puts in for this service) for infractions of the law. Be it littering,reckless driving or so on.
I saw enforce the laws to the fullest extent and stop making the public pay triple over what they are already putting in. All dunners need to be responsible, be it the ones that come out religiously or the a$$hole that comes out to start shiat and not even ride. Pack it in, pack it out. drink responsibly etc... If these simple precautions were followed, we would not need all of this big brother bullsh#t.

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If these simple precautions were followed, we would not need all of this big brother bullsh#t.

That's true... but none of those precautions are followed unless they are forced upon the a$$holes.

And enforcing the laws costs money... we need to make Congress take notice of this, get the appropriations increased, and make take back control of the OHMVR fund.

Vicki

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That's true... but none of those precautions are followed unless they are forced upon the a$$holes.

Nothing like some good ole hyperbole to keep the debate clear and concise!

NONE of the precautions are followed? You make it sound like we're a bunch of lawless, godless heathens out to destroy the world. And does this mean that we're all assholes? Since NONE of the precautions are being followed unless they are FORCED on us assholes.

I think you've bought into the Greenies propoganda.

I must have misunderstood... I thought the a$$holes he was referring to were the ones that don't follow the precautions... trash the dunes, drink irresponsibly...

But I'm sure they'll stop without any enforcement. What was I thinking.

Vicki

I would say a good 50% of the public that ue the dunes respect the common sense rules. they pick up their trash and even the trash that is not theirs, keep their camp respectable, ride with respect and caution, and so on. Its the other half that are the a-holes. They come out and have no respect for the area, they are usually the ones who start the fights, run over some other rider and then bail(if they can). these are the people who ruin it for all of us. Probably like you, I've been going to Glamis before there were any closures. On a big weekend you didnt have to worry about a million people all trying to be in the same spot, unfortunately times have changed and Glamis has also. Too bad it went for the worst. Now its starting to become a pay to play area because of some indigents. that is just crap.



I will never be a greenie or fall for their propoganda!
now PETA is a different story.

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I was in a wreck 5 years ago on a CA secondary road.  An ambulance came and took me and my wife to the hospital.  They charged us $5,000 for the trip and for the ER doctor to take some Xrays and let us both go within 30 min. there were charges like $75.00 for putting a board under my wife's neck etc etc.

My ambulance ride to the hospital from Glamis cost my insurance company $800. The ambulance service is privately owned and recieves no federal/state funding. The rangers that gave me immediate medical care recieved no money aside from the taxes I already pay.

If you were to have had fire/rescue personel on the scene of your accident, you wouldn't have had to pay. Even if they raise the fee demo to $300, the ambulance ride would still be lots of money.