I learned today that the California Legislature is set to "raid" ("borrow') $ 90 million from the OHV fund and send the bucks to the General Fund.

Its on page 11 (PDF file #'s when page is rendered) of the proposed Governor's budget for 2009-2010.

http://www.ebudget.ca.gov/pdf/GovernorsBudget/3000/3790.pdf (for those who like to make sure I'm on the mark)

But the interesting part is that the OHV lobbyist has not got this out to the OHV groups, or the OHV groups have not got this out to the OHV public????

Any in the "OHV leadership" wish to comment and fill us in????

WOW! I don't like the direction this is going!!! What can be done?

90 million, and we have trouble getting a few bucks for trash cans...

225 years worth of trash service.

Give me to tomorrow to give you an answer.

But at this time, if you belong to an OHV group, contact them and ask them to look into this.

That sux but on the bright side maybe they will keep green sticker areas open because it's a good fund to steal from and it generates dough

You know what Steve (Duck for those that don't know his name), why don't you just come after me with a baseball bat...you know I'm the Legislative Representative for the ASA. You also know how to pick up the phone to call me to ask if I'd heard anything...but instead, again, you start a thread with your spin on it...your spin of adding a little tidbit drama...leading individuals on a path of deception instead of letting them choose the path they wish to take. So much for mutual respect? Guess I know now where I stand with you.



I have been in contact with the ASA's lobbyists throughout this entire state fiscal crisis. It's been known all along that the OHV Trust Fund was in danger of the legislature wanting our money. Have I talked to him yesterday or today?....at of 7am today...NO I HAVE NOT TALKED TO HIM! I have been up to my eyeballs yesterday with little league and now I'm trying to leave for the OHMVR Grant workshop that I'm attending today in Ontario with the state's OHMVR Division. (So I'll be with the Deputy Director and Chief of the Division)

If anyone would like more information, please feel free to email me at legislativeaffairs@americansandassociation.org or legislation@sdorc.org

Thank you,

Vicki Cossey
Legislative Affairs,
American Sand Association

Director of Legislation,
San Diego Off Road Coalition

How can people choose the path if they don't know it's there? Thousands of people have put their faith in the various organizations to keep them informed so how come this is the first public discussion on it? I'm pretty sure that was Duck's whole point in the way he posted this. The fact that he was right and it hit a nerve doesn't change anything. If that's what it takes to get someone to publicly address the issue, more power to him. We're all just lucky that he hasn't gotten fed up with having to bird dog like so many others have, or this news would have remained on the down-low.

Instead of getting all defensive and personal this would be an opportunity to meet the challenge, rise up and actually get some information out to the people who will be hit by this.

It's extremely arrogant for any leader to expect each and every person they represent to come to them for information and publicly berating someone for not bothering to beg for some info is ridiculous. Instead of once again insulting someone who brings up a legitimate issue, try a humble approach (geez, sorry I've been busy let's see what we can do about this), pick up the ball and inform the public.

Thank you again Duck, for staying informed and doing what you can to make sure others are informed too. While you're at it, could you refresh my memory as to how the State was given the power to raid the fund? Is there specific legislation that addresses this?

Vicki W.
[edited just because]

Look close folks, it is in the governors 2009-2010 proposed budget, not the current over due 2008-2009 budget. It is a NEW release of information by the governor.

Ride on
Brewster

And that my friends, is the problem. Not singling out any one person, I know everyone has lives, but the big Orgs cant take questions about their actions or inactions. In the post above, the comment is made about picking up the phone. How many members of the ASA actually have personal numbers to a board member? Does that board member actually want a bunch of different calls? Even if he did call, what about the rest of its audience? Why do the Orgs biatch when a question is asked? Is asking the Orgs to INFORM such a bad thing?

Just send us a check and drink the kool aid has got how many acres reopened?

Looks like it was released on Jan 06. Has ANYONE had time to digest this yet? I would think some homework needs to be done.

At this moment, there is a OHV Division Grants meeting being held in Ontario CA.

According to Ms. Greene and Mr. Jenkins from the OHV Division, there is no raid of the fund.

But according to the 2009-2010 budget, page 11 of the Department of Parks and Recreation budget:

TO0001 To General Fund loan per pending legislation - -90,000 [million] [from budget year 2008-2009 from OHV Fund]

Seems clear as day to me, but I could be wrong.

I downloaded and skimmed it, but did not catch this. It was brought to my attention by Toms Jeeps via a post from Brewster on the District 37 AMA forum.

Seems Brewster did a rather excellent job picking this apart and he seems to have digested it rather well.

So we have nothing to worry about then???

I don't know quite yet.

The budget is quite clear. The OHV Division may or may not be on the up and up.

Their may be a "trailer bill" for the budget issue we are facing at this moment (not the 2009-2010 proposed budget) that will be tacked into a vote to fix our existing budget. This vote is likely in the next week or so.

The point is there's no new information.


I haven't posted anything anywhere because there's nothing to report as of yet.

As I've mentioned before, the threat of the OHV Trust Fund being raided has been there for some time. The legislatures at any time can pass a bill that will allow them to get into it.

Why stir the pot until there are facts to post?

Thanks for the info again Duck.

Just my opinion, but wouldn't it be better for the ASA to just say that in the first place? Hey gang, the state is at it again, blah blah blah, no new info, but we are on it, blah blah blah, we'll keep you informed...


At least the public knows it wasnt missed or ignored...

Duck,

Please start a thread on S22.


Sand Commander did and its already falling off into oblivion.
(Not getting any discussion...action....)


I recall S21 of the early 90's and how it impacted the Federal BLM land that we use today.

The FACTS Vicki are clearly in the proposed budget. Please direct your attention to a post I made at (board time) 9:45 a.m.

Vicki, might I suggest you please contact the lobbyist and have him read the budget at the places cited above? I'd think its their job to assess this proposed budget and bring this to the client's attention... even if its a possiblity.

Sound good.

I need yet to get to work. I'm so late I'm embarrased. Thanks to my employer for allowing me the time to work on this stuff.

The treat of the legislature raiding the OHV Trust Fund (as well as every other trust fund) is there every day. It's the government. If they want it....they'll pass something to take it.

Kinna like they just did with the dumpster funds. Not a damm thing anyone of us could have done about that one either.
Government of the people and by the people? So much for that I guess...

The fact that it is in the PROPOSED budget should send up the flags! Should we wait until it is enacted before we contact the governor and legislatures? I think not!
The money in the OHV fund is specifically designated for the OHV program, unlike the money in the General Fund.

Ride on
Brewster

If there is buget carryover, we should be yelling to have the funds diverted to glamis use.....

So who do we write to on this?? (Just to make sure i does not happen)

From what I'm hearing this "raid" (loan) may be in an upcoming "trailer bill" as part of the Gov/Legislature, not yet disclosed.

That there my fellow duner is how I and many of my duning friends and family feel! Quote of the century!



thanks Duck, informative and timely.

Please don't make this something its not.

I'm informing folks who read this forum and asking questions of the "OHV leadership" who participate in this forum.

All I'm asking is for some answers to what appears to be valid questions.

Thanks Vicki!!!

Some of us appreciate you and all you do! Keep up the good work!


ALSO for those of you who want to "attack" someone for the fact that the state may raid this fund.......blame the CA Government!! They are the folks who make sure that certain funding sources have loop holes in them so that they can raid them during times of need (or mismanagement of the state funds).

Sorry, I didn't attack anyone.

Again, I reported the facts and asked a question from our "OHV Leadership".

Vicki C holds a title and should have a grasp of what is going on. Vicki decided to address this issue on behalf of ASA and SDORC.

Back in my day as a former CORVA officer (or just a volunteer) we would get this stuff out to our membership via telephone, direct mail, faxes (when such became available in the early days of this) and the like. We didn't have an internet nor e-mails to communicate. We just made it happen.

And as a former CORVA officer (and life member), its interesting to me that the one major OHV group who, at this time, does not have a lobbyist - makes this issue public (abet with the help of Brewster), and gets "attacked" for disclosing the issue.

Vicki's group(s) have a lobbyist (I believe both of them) who are paid a boat load of money to protect their interests.

It would appear that they (the lobbyist) dropped the ball on this one.

I just chose to bring the issue of the "raid" to those who read this forum. Then, I questioned the "OHV leadership" about what they know/knew about this subject.

Vicki seems to be trying hard to do a good job, but this is a complex bunch of issues she is attempting to deal with.

I foster no ill will towards her.

When is the appropriate time to bring these matters to light? It seems to be the time is after all the committee meetings have taken place and the out come decided is the right time. Then put up a show fight for the public and get those donation dollars rolling in.

Actually what should happen is the money just get added to following years grants, lift the caps and just let all the applicants have at it, they got $94 Million last year for what did any mainstream Orgs even ask???...TJ

Well... it looks as if we are not # 1 on the "hit parade as far as special fund raids, but we are close at # 2

I received this today....

Governor’s Proposed Special Fund Loans— Resources and Environmental Protection Special Funds

(Dollars in Millions) Special Fund Amount of Loan Year of Loan Repayment Date

California Beverage Container Recycling Fund $99.4 2009-10 2012-13

Off-Highway Vehicle Trust Fund 90.0 2008-09 2012-13 (partial payments beginning in 2010-11)

School Land Bank Fund 61.0 2008-09 2012-13 Fish and Game Preservation Fund, Non-dedicated Account 30.0 2008-09 2012-13

Harbors and Watercraft Revolving Fund 29.0 2008-09 2012-13 (partial payments beginning in 2010-11)

California Tire Recycling Manage-ment Fund 17.1 Deferral of repayment of 2003-04 loan, initially budgeted in 2008-09 2011-12

California Tire Recycling Manage-ment Fund 10.0 2008-09 2010-11

California Teleconnect Fund Administrative Committee Fund 5.0 Deferral of partial repayment of 2003-04 loan, initially budgeted in 2008-09 2010-11

Integrated Waste Management Account 4.8 Deferral of repayment of 2003-04 loan, initially budgeted in 2008-09 2009-10

Recycling Market Development Re-volving Loan Subaccount 1.9 Deferral of repayment of 2003-04 loan, initially budgeted in 2008-09 2011-12

Total $348.2 million.

For some reason one of Arnold's old movies comes to mind, you know the one on Mars what was that???

"O" yes of course TOTAL RECALL really even Davis never raided our OHV fund...TJ

they will shut down our OHV areas and still make us register our motorcycles. and if you dont they will just take it out of your taxes. welcome to liberal america

The BIG 5, just in case anyone wanted to know who's actually working on this.


part of SB 742


This came from DARRELL STEINBERG (D) now Senate President pro Tem. (Author of SB 742)



This came from Governor Schwarzenegger ®

OK why, question to those at the table on SB742 (1) did this even get discussed, (2) if so what were you told to expect from this???...TJ

TJ, where did you get this? :

"FO0265 From Conservation and Enforcement Services Account, Off-Highway Vehicle Trust Fund per Item 3790-401, Budget Act of 2007 TO0001 To General Fund loan per pending legislation - -90,000 - (all figures are in thousands of Dollars".

Thanks

Ride on
Brewster

http://www.ebudget.ca.gov/pdf/GovernorsBudget/3000/3790.pdf

Page 11

Come on now Tom... those sitting at the table "working on our behalf" didn't consult its membership and the average motorized recreationist back in those days until the deal was essentially done. Heck, only one more major OHV org (CORVA) has informed and mobilized this community on this subject.

What makes you think they would do so now?

Credibility...TJ

38225 (d) was in there prior to SB742 and has been there ever since the 80's.

Did you want that language to sunset and not have any protection?

Pre-SB742


If the program sunset, that $90M would have been transferred to the General Fund. Do you remember this discussion?

Actually no, so is this what you were told agree to this or loose all of it, I frankly would have said GO AHEAD myself, start with a clean sheet of paper and start over...TJ

Nope.

I was just refreshing your memory. Or maybe you didn't comment on that part?

But it was in writing....if that wasn't extended, any money left in the fund would have went to the General Fund on 1/1/07...then it would have never had to be paid back.


Edit for link:

http://www.glamisdunes.com/invision/index.php?showforum=181

For many a year the program has had a "sunset provision" in general. SB 742 too has a sunset provision.

From what I can read from SB 742 in this regard, nothing has really changed. If the program were to sunset, then monies from the program would have to go somewhere.

Brew I'm confused I patted you on the back on Pirate for finding this, by the way that is you posting as Brewster2 on Pirate4x4.com???...TJ

Vicky please if you going to qoute the forum don't throw the whole thing at me, narrow it down a bit...TJ

Sorry Tom! I thought I did! It's Section 21. There were a couple of discussions. I did a quick scan and didn't see a post from you but that doesn't mean it wasn't there.

Let me dig out the specific links...

http://www.glamisdunes.com/invision/index....howtopic=118996

http://www.glamisdunes.com/invision/index....howtopic=108489

OK, so I can take it the short answer to my question is (1) it was not discussed, main reason sited some version of it was all ready there, well what difference does that make and yes I did comment I didn't want in in SB 742...TJ