Had a friend tell me that while at Giant RV, he was told by a service advisor about a problem with ToyBox Trailers. Advisor said that the walls on a ToyBox Trailer will eventually sage due to no supports in the center between the frame rails and because the walls extend over the frame rails with no support. The mounting of cabinets and other heavy items cause the problem. Apparently the garage models do not have this problem because of the wall separating the garage from the living space. Giant RV charges $2000.00 for a retro fix by welding supports to the frame. Has anyone heard of this? It is suppose to affect all manufactures of ToyBox Trailers/Fifthwheels.

That would be good to know, which manufactures/models does it affect if in fact the issue is there?

That is a true statement. My rampage did that. I have two other friends that had the same problem. A friend helped me fix mine. My two other buddy's had theirs repaired at shops.

I'm having a hard time believing that. Perhaps some have had that problem, but not all.

I have a 2003 40' WW SLC3905 and I store my 2500lb rail and 900 lb golf cart in it for about 8 months of the yr. I haven't noticed any sagging yet. I don't understand how they could sag (other than too weak of a frame) because the entire trailer is supported in the center, via the wheels attached to the frame. I could see if the trailer was stored with both ends supported an the center left unsupported, but that's not the case.

I also have a 1999 25' Sierra trailer, and it also has not sagged (yet).

Wingnut....can you explain how you and your friend fixed the problem? $2000.00 for Giant RV to fix the probelm seems very expensive.

I know they had to go in and lift the box off the trailer.Weld in the outrigger supports for the body and set it back down.

The statement was too general, no specific models mentioned? Sounds like nothing more than a sales pitch for some service $. I know when I used to take the coach to the dealer for warranty repairs it was something new they were pushing EVERY time I went in... Unless there is evidence of said problem tell him to keep his jack$$$

When I was looking to buy in 2002 One of the selling points for me was the warriors already have "outriggers" for wall support. There was a few other builders that had them also.
bought a warrior, still own it and no sagging

Had my Attitude repaired like this, but for another reason. When Zieman welded the outriggers for the fender supports to my frame, they got the frame metal too hot and it cracked over time and let the outrigger push into and almost through the frame. Took it to Attitude (Eclipse) in Riverside and they had Zieman come back and do what is noted above, but they plated over the spots in the frame where the outrigger had pushed through and then rewelded the outrigger back on. No problems ..... so far. KNOCK ON WOOD. Zieman would not cover the repair which I was pissed about, but they only charged me $300 and now I have a paper trail if it ever happens again. Eclipse service guy told me that they do see this from time to time, so I'd say this is a Fact, just maybe not for the same reasons.

There is very little truth to that statement. I have worked in the RV industry for going on 16 years. First off all toy haulers have outriggers. In the beggining they were straight outriggers, then MFG's switched to Z bar outriggers for extra support. Most of the MFG's have all had their share of outrigger failure. Its not on every coach and some MFG's have had recalls on this issue. But to say that all toy haulers have frame isssues is false. All trailers have their issues but if every one was going to have chassis issues, MFG's would be out of business. If your worried about your particular toy hauler then go and have a few extra Z bar outriggers added to your unit.

I've had three WW's for a total of only 12 yrs. never have I had or heard of this being an issue. Suddenly yesterday someone explained this possible issue to me yesterday.

I don't know, guess I'll wait till it happens to me.

The fix was explained to me was to gently lift the the bottom of the walls & "suspend" the coach slightly taking the weight off the axles. then weld some things onto the outriggers.

Seriously though, how much different is the construction of a the different than a regular coach in the aspect of hoe the walls are attached.

Then comes the fact that giant rv was the one making the statement, all I can say is consider the source.

Had my warrior in for its first time when I bought it and they added the outriggers at no cost. I think they did 3 or 4 on each side...

total bs, they just want 2k outa your pocket!!! my ww was built in 1999. it has the outrigers on it, always has.

When I was shopping for WW back in the day that was their big sales point. They didn't have a cantilever off the edge of the frame on the wide bodies. Their big bash on the competition was this sag issue. However, WW had their own frame issues in the end, so it didn't even matter at that point. You need need to find what manufacture build their walls on the frame, and how they were attached. The attachment was another issue. They said their competitors walls were pulling up..HOWEVER. Now my thoughts....I think they are essentially just as good for the most part. If you don't thrash them, then you wont have an issue. I had the fs3000 with the frame recall. I hauled a long travel car and all the tanks were full. I had no problem with the frame. I guess it's all in who you talk to on any given day...

True, but a regular coach doesn't have cars driving into it.



The issues with the frame, I think, had a lot to do with people overloading them (basing their load capacity on the sticker, not real world weight) and not disconnecting the WD bars over rough terrain.

The 3 axle toy haulers were the most likely ones to have this problem, since there was a fairly large span inside the fender that didn't have outriggers. Combine this with the fact that many buggies sit with their wheels right above this weaker area, and you have sag issues. I have seen it in person on 2 WW trailers I was checking out to buy, which prompted me to search some forums and found a number of people had this problem.

All in all, it's a simple fix though. One guy I saw just jacked it up with a bottle jack and welded in some additional outriggers and was done. The biggest problem isn't so much in the sagging, but the leaks that can occur from the sagging ruining the wood in the walls and floor.

I have a buddy that has a 38-39' Gear Box that had this problem. He noticed that the kitchen cabinets had a huge gap at the corner of the floor. You could see a huge bow in the floor as if the walls were pushing down so hard it put a crown in the center of the floor. They warrantied it and lifted the walls and adding heavier duty out rigging. I don't think it has anything to do with the load in the trailer because his sand rail rides in the back no where near the kitchen area. Problem solved.

I also have 03 ww 3905 no sagging have supports outside the frame both sides the whole lenght

I had a 1998 dunes trailer when traded in they checked for it they said the older models where built on a regular chassis and when used off road this could happen that was in 2002

the problem is that the sides push down on the edge and lift the center of the floor up. to stop this jack the trailer completely off the ground at the front and back and weld in cross bars at the bottom of the frame to stop the two frame rails from flexing together. if you open your rear door and bounce up and down on the dove tail part of the floor dont jump just bounce you will see the fender wells pull away from the wall.

I have a 05' 37' Gearbox 5th wheel and I can see the bow in my floor. From the walls to the frame rails the floor drops almost 1" in a 16" span. I think the frame will fail, my pin box has already pushed up into the front bed room.

Thats doesnt sound good at all.

Believe me, I realize that. But even still the majority of the weight being added is over the frame rails, not outside the frame next to the wall.

Whatever the case, like I said, I have very "little" experience with th's (3 WW's for the past 12 yrs.). The current one having a little more than 30k miles on it. We've never had such an issue.

That's not to say it doesn't happen, seems as though I eat poo happens & as of yet we have yet to be a recipient of that.

This a problem that all people with be trailers should fix before it gets too bad. Mys sag is about 1/4" at the wheelwells after about 8000 miles 40' Ragen. I have z-bar outriggers every 24" and doubles infront and behind the wheel wells. I have jacked up the trailer at 4 points in front and behind the wells and removed the inner wheel well covers, the floor is now flat again. Looking at my z bars they are fine, no deformation. They have actually deformed the web of the I beam. I am going to weld in 1" square tubing from the outer edge of the zbar under the wall to the intersection of the web and the flange of the I beam. This is a 45' angle and shouldn't deform the beam as it is much stronger there. I am also going th add a steel angle under the wall in the wheel well area and support it with 2" square tube struts between each of the wheels. I will add a gusset across the whole beam to keep the "struts" from twisting. For good measure I am going to weld square tubing across the frame at the front and rear axle spring shackles to "box the frame". I have Weighed all my parts and it is about 70 lbs on a 13k trailer. Will take pics next time I work on it

I will add that those aluminum frame vacuum bonded walls on my trailer are not light. Highway 5 from the bay area and Highway 80 over the sierras are absolutely bone jarring so I am not surprised. My aluminum sided warrior showed no signs of this after 8 years of use those walls are super light. The smooth sided trailers are the ones to fix before they get bad. $2000 isn't too far off if they are going to guarantee their fix against future sagging. It is a time consuming not too fun job

When I was looking at my trailer NEW, UNUSED, I notice that the wheel wells looked like they were slanted out. After having it for abuot a year I took it in and they fixed the outriggers. My trailer is 34" tripple axle and the said because if the lengh, it would bow or flex. The outriggers where from the frame to the outer edge of the trailer but they did not have a break or 90deg bend on the outer edge. They added better outriggers for free. The old ones would just flex with the trialer. Its an easy fix with a welder.


I've had a few friends buy toyhaulers since and tell them to check for the better outriggers, so far all of them have had them. 2K seems a little high.

Any pics of the fixes?

I will take some pics over the weekend. Anybody with the drive on wheel wells? How are they supported at the wall? I cant believe the wall is strong enough to handle any significant load especially a triple axle.

here are some pictures, hope this works

My 03 26' Rampage walls started sagging. In 06 or 07 I called Skyline. They said they knew about the problem. Had me deliver it to a local dealer, put it on a trailer for Hemet and fixed it for FREE by adding outriggers. All the newer Skylines now have outriggers. I'm not even the original owner. I can't say enough about Skyline's customer service.

It seems like to me that the trailers with the wall sag have all had sand rails in them, has anyone without a rail ever had a sag issue?

dunefool, thanks for posting your pics. I have the same trailer (40ft Ragen) and am in the process of making the same mods. I too am only seeing minimal sag, 1/4 inch or less behind the wheel wells. the rest of the floor is looking ok so I am getting this done before it gets worse.

there are a couple of spots where you can run square tubing between the frame rails, I put them right behind where the outriggers are welded. I jacked up the body on each side and then welded the cross pieces in place. I was able to reduce some or all of the floor sag in the 2 places I did this.

Im getting this mod done soon to my trailer.

I have a WW SLC3705 that had sagging walls. New supports in the triple axle wheel well and that thing is solid as a rock.

i know im replying to an old post, but ill do it anyway. ive had my rampage since 07 and ive put my bug in it 3 times. the previous owner used to put a k5 sand drag blazer in it. my walls didnt seem to be sagging, rather the outriggers were bending and the frame cracking. k&n customs in homeland fixed it after my siding started coming off from other issues...

Some pix of my repairs on my 23' here on this thread. So Cal RV Dr. fixed mine.
http://www.glamisdunes.com/invision/index....p;#entry4013992

here is a pic of the body supports I made and installed last week in front and behind the wheel well



they are the full height of the I beam


I also connected the spring hangers


I was experiencing only minimal body sag 1/4 inch or less and was able to reduce some to most of it in different places.

in the four years with my 08 CR with a heavy dual sport, I have never had the walls sag, But this year I had a water jet company cut out plates and I used a bottle jack to put some positive camber in the walls and welded on the frame,