My comments can be found at the following link:
http://www.rosewitz.org/ISDRAramp/Vince_DRAMP_comments4.pdf
Here is the pic referenced in the comments
Click to view attachment
Feel free to cut and paste if you share my views.
If implementted as currently proposed by the BLM, the new plan will:
·INCREASE PERMANENT CLOSURES
·DECREASE CAMPING ACREAGE
·RESTRICT CAMP AREA USE
The Deadline for Public Comments on the Draft Imperial Sand Dune Recreation Management Plan is near. OUR COMMENTS WILL COUNT.
ACT NOW: the Deadline is Aug 7, 2010
email your personal comments to Erin Dreyfuss (caisdrmp@ca.blm.gov)
or by US mail to:
BLM
attention Erin Dreyfuss
1661 S. 4th Street
El Centro, CA 92243
Don't forget to include you contact info or your comments are void.
Full Version: My Dramp Comments
Great comments.
Point 3 re: dune buggy flats, I believe your sentence should read "... lacks sufficient rationale". You forgot the E on the end of rationale.
I think overall you make valid points. The problem as I see it seems to be that nobody on the RAMP committee or whatever it is called has any real interest in the science. My perception is that this RAMP and PMV and other 'endangered' things seem to just be cover for the real goal of restricting use. Thus, refuting the claim about endangered plants is not productive because it is not their real goal/concern.
I think overall you make valid points. The problem as I see it seems to be that nobody on the RAMP committee or whatever it is called has any real interest in the science. My perception is that this RAMP and PMV and other 'endangered' things seem to just be cover for the real goal of restricting use. Thus, refuting the claim about endangered plants is not productive because it is not their real goal/concern.
We always have known that rain is what makes the PMV grow or not grow, but no correlation has ever been done. To that end, here it is.
The rainfall data was taken from the Cauhilla ranger station and the Buttercup automated weather station (AWS) web pages. Each plot is the rainfall for the month as indicated added to the previous month - so it accumulates. The chart shows only rainfall from September through April as rains in other months probably don't do much good for the PMV and would clutter the graph. PMV numbers were taken from the BLM survey reports and are divided by 250,000 to keep the graph scale within reasonable limits.
The chart covers the following growing seasons:
2003 Survey for the 02-03 Growing Season: Not much rain so low PMV numbers
2004 Survey for the 03-04 Growing Season: What little rain there was came too late
2005 Survey for the 04-05 Growing Season: Rains started in August and were consistent through the season resulting in explosive germination and seed production. As perfect a rain curve as we're likely to see.
2006 Survey for the 05-06 Growing Season: A big storm in August, then little after that resulting in the worst year
2007 Survey for the 06-07 Growing Season: Fair amount of rain at beginning of season, not much after that - fewer numbers than if rain had continued.
Even though not scientific (but the data used is), the rain data we have is from only two stations, and rains can occur in one area and not another, it still paints a vivid picture - bottom line: the amount and timing of rain makes the plants grow (or not).
I hope you see fit to use this in your comments on the DRAMP.
Click to view attachment
The rainfall data was taken from the Cauhilla ranger station and the Buttercup automated weather station (AWS) web pages. Each plot is the rainfall for the month as indicated added to the previous month - so it accumulates. The chart shows only rainfall from September through April as rains in other months probably don't do much good for the PMV and would clutter the graph. PMV numbers were taken from the BLM survey reports and are divided by 250,000 to keep the graph scale within reasonable limits.
The chart covers the following growing seasons:
2003 Survey for the 02-03 Growing Season: Not much rain so low PMV numbers
2004 Survey for the 03-04 Growing Season: What little rain there was came too late
2005 Survey for the 04-05 Growing Season: Rains started in August and were consistent through the season resulting in explosive germination and seed production. As perfect a rain curve as we're likely to see.
2006 Survey for the 05-06 Growing Season: A big storm in August, then little after that resulting in the worst year
2007 Survey for the 06-07 Growing Season: Fair amount of rain at beginning of season, not much after that - fewer numbers than if rain had continued.
Even though not scientific (but the data used is), the rain data we have is from only two stations, and rains can occur in one area and not another, it still paints a vivid picture - bottom line: the amount and timing of rain makes the plants grow (or not).
I hope you see fit to use this in your comments on the DRAMP.
Click to view attachment
Kind of a simple reply:
Send in something.
QUOTE
To whom it may concern, or Erin Dreyfuss
I go to the deserts with my family to enjoy the great outdoors that is America. Every year the government and environmentalists are closing more and more areas restricting public use. You are confining vacationers to smaller and smaller areas which in turn cause more deaths and injuries. Please stop confining all the citizens into smaller and smaller areas. My children and many American citizens lives depend on it. Stop closing us out. A very concerned American citizen.
I go to the deserts with my family to enjoy the great outdoors that is America. Every year the government and environmentalists are closing more and more areas restricting public use. You are confining vacationers to smaller and smaller areas which in turn cause more deaths and injuries. Please stop confining all the citizens into smaller and smaller areas. My children and many American citizens lives depend on it. Stop closing us out. A very concerned American citizen.
Send in something.
Hello Erin,
I have started this e mail numerous times only to erase it and move on to other day to day matters. I have been an avid off road enthusiast for over thirty years. During this time I have frequented the high desert, low desert as well as Glamis & Dumont Dunes. I have seen environmental laws and regulations used as a weapon by those wishing to have public land cordoned off keeping people such as myself from enjoying the sport I hold so dear.
In attempting to work within the system I helped fund environmental studies through membership fees and donations to associations who represent responsible off road enthusiasts. These studies clearly show the success of the Pierson’s Milk Vetch is tied to rainfall with little to no effect form off road vehicles. Based on these studies I thought we’d be able to go back to the old agreement keeping everything North of Highway 78 except Mammoth Wash off limits while abolishing the central closures. This apparently is not to be. I have come to realize the goal of the Center for Biological Diversity is not the wellbeing of the indigenous plants and animals, the goal is ending the sport of off road riding. So be it. I now find myself writing this e mail to you and quite frankly don’t know where to go with it. On one hand I want to convey my disgust with the whole system with a tantrum regarding how I now intend to be one of the 3% of riders with zero regard for rules who are used as poster children for why Glamis should be closed. The other side of me wants to beg you to stand up to environmental extortion. Erin, I honestly don’t know which statement to make.
I guess this is the best I can do as I’m just tired of fighting for access to PUBLIC land. However this thing works out I’ll be riding in the dunes, either I’ll be a responsible family man who leaves his campsite better than he found it or as an outlaw chased down because he violated some ridicules central closure that was put in place for exactly that purpose so I can be held up as an example of not following the rules. I don’t envy your assigned task and I understand the power of the people on the opposite side of the issue, all that can be expected from you is impartiality, unfortunately money funding lawsuit after lawsuit makes expedience a lot more attractive. Good luck to you in finding some sort of compromise, however this pans out I’ll behave accordingly.
Best regards,
Philip
I have started this e mail numerous times only to erase it and move on to other day to day matters. I have been an avid off road enthusiast for over thirty years. During this time I have frequented the high desert, low desert as well as Glamis & Dumont Dunes. I have seen environmental laws and regulations used as a weapon by those wishing to have public land cordoned off keeping people such as myself from enjoying the sport I hold so dear.
In attempting to work within the system I helped fund environmental studies through membership fees and donations to associations who represent responsible off road enthusiasts. These studies clearly show the success of the Pierson’s Milk Vetch is tied to rainfall with little to no effect form off road vehicles. Based on these studies I thought we’d be able to go back to the old agreement keeping everything North of Highway 78 except Mammoth Wash off limits while abolishing the central closures. This apparently is not to be. I have come to realize the goal of the Center for Biological Diversity is not the wellbeing of the indigenous plants and animals, the goal is ending the sport of off road riding. So be it. I now find myself writing this e mail to you and quite frankly don’t know where to go with it. On one hand I want to convey my disgust with the whole system with a tantrum regarding how I now intend to be one of the 3% of riders with zero regard for rules who are used as poster children for why Glamis should be closed. The other side of me wants to beg you to stand up to environmental extortion. Erin, I honestly don’t know which statement to make.
I guess this is the best I can do as I’m just tired of fighting for access to PUBLIC land. However this thing works out I’ll be riding in the dunes, either I’ll be a responsible family man who leaves his campsite better than he found it or as an outlaw chased down because he violated some ridicules central closure that was put in place for exactly that purpose so I can be held up as an example of not following the rules. I don’t envy your assigned task and I understand the power of the people on the opposite side of the issue, all that can be expected from you is impartiality, unfortunately money funding lawsuit after lawsuit makes expedience a lot more attractive. Good luck to you in finding some sort of compromise, however this pans out I’ll behave accordingly.
Best regards,
Philip
Nice.
Sent today.
QUOTE
Erin, you may not remember me; Christina Gonzales and I interviewed you and Neil Hamada in Glamis around Easter 2006 for Fox-11 News in Los Angeles. I'm sure you have had your hands full with public comment since the DRAMP was released; however, I'd like you to take just a few moments to read yet another one.
I'm not going to go over the various points that have been made about the nature, scope, and reliability of the scientific studies, or attempt to reinforce (or refute) any of the contentions about OHV activity and its participants, good or bad. Suffice to say that I grew up exploring the desert Southwest in offroad vehicles, and now my family and I continue that tradition with other families all over southern California.
My issue with this process is one that came into much sharper relief during the taping of those segments in 2006. Namely, that the issue of motorized offroad recreation in the ISDRA is not really about protecting the PMV, or desert tortoise, or scarab beetle. It's about whether or not a small but vocal minority can invoke a specious "greater good" argument to effectively outlaw an entire class of vehicle, and by extension deny the public the right to recreate responsibly on public lands. Legal challenges under the ESA are only a means to that end, and will not (I repeat, NOT) end with the adoption of any version of the proposed RAMP, even the most restrictive alternative. Organizations like the CBD and PEER have dedicated themselves to the elimination of OHV use, period... and will continue to use whatever avenues are available to that end; the phrase "by any means necessary" comes to mind. This ten-year battle over the PMV is only one salvo in that war.
The RAMP staff have attempted to balance the ESA requirements with the public's right of access, and based upon the indicated preferred alternative RAMP have done so admirably. I would of course prefer that no restrictions were placed upon motorized recreation or camping within the ISDRA, but I recognize that compromises must be made. I wish only that our opponents were as accommodating.
Bottom line: We in the OHV community are not monsters. We are families who only want to continue to enjoy our little slices of desert in the manner we prefer. There are literally tens of millions of acres of desert habitat closed to us, while only a few hundred thousand remain open for our use. Please don't take away any more of what little we have left.
Regards,
Dave Wehlage
<address redacted>
dave.wehlage@FoxTV.com
I'm not going to go over the various points that have been made about the nature, scope, and reliability of the scientific studies, or attempt to reinforce (or refute) any of the contentions about OHV activity and its participants, good or bad. Suffice to say that I grew up exploring the desert Southwest in offroad vehicles, and now my family and I continue that tradition with other families all over southern California.
My issue with this process is one that came into much sharper relief during the taping of those segments in 2006. Namely, that the issue of motorized offroad recreation in the ISDRA is not really about protecting the PMV, or desert tortoise, or scarab beetle. It's about whether or not a small but vocal minority can invoke a specious "greater good" argument to effectively outlaw an entire class of vehicle, and by extension deny the public the right to recreate responsibly on public lands. Legal challenges under the ESA are only a means to that end, and will not (I repeat, NOT) end with the adoption of any version of the proposed RAMP, even the most restrictive alternative. Organizations like the CBD and PEER have dedicated themselves to the elimination of OHV use, period... and will continue to use whatever avenues are available to that end; the phrase "by any means necessary" comes to mind. This ten-year battle over the PMV is only one salvo in that war.
The RAMP staff have attempted to balance the ESA requirements with the public's right of access, and based upon the indicated preferred alternative RAMP have done so admirably. I would of course prefer that no restrictions were placed upon motorized recreation or camping within the ISDRA, but I recognize that compromises must be made. I wish only that our opponents were as accommodating.
Bottom line: We in the OHV community are not monsters. We are families who only want to continue to enjoy our little slices of desert in the manner we prefer. There are literally tens of millions of acres of desert habitat closed to us, while only a few hundred thousand remain open for our use. Please don't take away any more of what little we have left.
Regards,
Dave Wehlage
<address redacted>
dave.wehlage@FoxTV.com
WOW that was a very nicely written letter with many fine points!
QUOTE (D.O.N.E. @ Jul 29 2010, 02:19 PM) 
WOW that was a very nicely written letter with many fine points!We need to make clear to them why their proposed plan is not a good idea - quote studies and science, or, the lack of it, when it comes to closing off camping areas and the critical habitat for the PMV. If few of us oppose these actions, then for sure the science will not matter as they will perceive our lack of action (protest) as buying in to the closures.
The work has all been done for you and is posted at the following links. THE DEADLINE IS AUGUST 9
http://files.americansandassociation.org/f...(7-17-2010).doc
http://files.americansandassociation.org/f...20comments4.doc
http://files.americansandassociation.org/f...%202010%20DRAMP[3].doc
http://files.americansandassociation.org/f...0(6-2-2010).doc
Heck, I tried to give away money / gift cards to get folks to do it - even that was a tough sell.
Most folks wont care until after it is closed. We can just take our toys and go home then.
Most folks wont care until after it is closed. We can just take our toys and go home then.
Don't worry Mr Brunasso, I've gone to all the links and submitted my comments some time ago.
Getting others to do the same....well thats another problem.
Just in case someone sees this thread and missed Yummi's...perhaps this will provide some inspiration
Erin,
I only recently began visiting the Imperial Sand Dunes Recreational Area (ISDRA). I must admit, since I began using the land and becoming more aware of the techniques used to manage the ISDRA, I have been sorely disappointed. I am quite aware of the need to protect particular plants, and or wildlife. As an avid backpacker, and National Park visitor I've had opportunities to see wild wolves, bears, mountain goats, and even some plants such as the beautiful Sego Lilly of Utah. However, I would never have had this opportunity without the ability to recreate in those lands. I would even say, that it was my ability to experience first hand all those sightings that instilled a personal passion about also preserving for future generations their ability to recreate and enjoy sightings of their own. A careful balance must be struck between preserving the land and wildlife with a management plan that allows visitors to recreate in, experience and enjoy the land.
And this is where my personal disappointment begins. I would fully support a management plan that used sound science to base decisions upon. It has become quite clear to me, the Bureau of Land management (BLM) has consistently chosen biased and often incomplete studies to back closures in the ISDRA. They have reached 'conclusions' from these studies for such things as recovery of the Pierson's Milk Vetch (PMV) without having enough information to even begin outlining what would determine the recovery as an actual success. They have also ignored numerous studies sponsored by and sent by the American Sand Association (ASA) regarding PMV. I won't waste time copying and pasting what's already been said. I fully support the comments already submitted by the ASA including Dr. Art Phillip and Dr. Glenn Haas.
With everything I have stated in mind, I would prefer a hybrid of alternatives 7 & 8. The idea closing of Dune Buggy Flats based on rainfall is unsubstantiated period. Closures need to have distinct boundaries that are easy to follow, and preferably take into account the natural flow of the terrain. It would seem wasteful at best to me to mark and enforce a closure area with so many peninsulas and long skinny fingers reaching away from the main body as in Alternative 8.
Regards,
Lena .....
Getting others to do the same....well thats another problem.
Just in case someone sees this thread and missed Yummi's...perhaps this will provide some inspiration
Erin,
I only recently began visiting the Imperial Sand Dunes Recreational Area (ISDRA). I must admit, since I began using the land and becoming more aware of the techniques used to manage the ISDRA, I have been sorely disappointed. I am quite aware of the need to protect particular plants, and or wildlife. As an avid backpacker, and National Park visitor I've had opportunities to see wild wolves, bears, mountain goats, and even some plants such as the beautiful Sego Lilly of Utah. However, I would never have had this opportunity without the ability to recreate in those lands. I would even say, that it was my ability to experience first hand all those sightings that instilled a personal passion about also preserving for future generations their ability to recreate and enjoy sightings of their own. A careful balance must be struck between preserving the land and wildlife with a management plan that allows visitors to recreate in, experience and enjoy the land.
And this is where my personal disappointment begins. I would fully support a management plan that used sound science to base decisions upon. It has become quite clear to me, the Bureau of Land management (BLM) has consistently chosen biased and often incomplete studies to back closures in the ISDRA. They have reached 'conclusions' from these studies for such things as recovery of the Pierson's Milk Vetch (PMV) without having enough information to even begin outlining what would determine the recovery as an actual success. They have also ignored numerous studies sponsored by and sent by the American Sand Association (ASA) regarding PMV. I won't waste time copying and pasting what's already been said. I fully support the comments already submitted by the ASA including Dr. Art Phillip and Dr. Glenn Haas.
With everything I have stated in mind, I would prefer a hybrid of alternatives 7 & 8. The idea closing of Dune Buggy Flats based on rainfall is unsubstantiated period. Closures need to have distinct boundaries that are easy to follow, and preferably take into account the natural flow of the terrain. It would seem wasteful at best to me to mark and enforce a closure area with so many peninsulas and long skinny fingers reaching away from the main body as in Alternative 8.
Regards,
Lena .....
QUOTE (yummi @ Aug 1 2010, 10:57 AM)
Heck, I tried to give away money / gift cards to get folks to do it - even that was a tough sell.
Most folks wont care until after it is closed. We can just take our toys and go home then.
That's pretty much the way it goes, I'm afraid. The enviros count on it. Most folks wont care until after it is closed. We can just take our toys and go home then.
At least I tried to lead the horses to the water...
I finally put together my comments and emailed them this evening.
Sent.
Sent mine as well....
I posted them in Yummi's thread.
I posted them in Yummi's thread.
Sent my letter today with all of my contact information as well. I hope that Erin seriously considers the comments and inputs made by the many board members that have responded!
I've got a letter drafted up, both as a personal and a form letter and have been collecting sigs... I have 7 so far... pushing for 20 envelopes to be sent out in the mail.
Letter sent.
Thanks to everyone that took the time to respond. I hope it helps - I know it won't hurt the cause.
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