OK, I just got word there are meetings next weekend.. what are the details of these meetings? You Org leaders want us to show up and help - Lets see the details.
ASA??
DUNERS??
Parties??
ORBA??
Sierra Club?
Full Version: Meetings?
ASA board meeting in San Diego.
From the ASA website:
SATURDAY, AUGUST 21, 2004 - 10AM
COURTYARD BY MARRIOTT
DOWNTOWN - SAN DIEGO
530 BROADWAY
SAN DIEGO 92101
Parking is limited, please plan to arrive early! There is no space for RV's or large vehicles.
SATURDAY, AUGUST 21, 2004 - 10AM
COURTYARD BY MARRIOTT
DOWNTOWN - SAN DIEGO
530 BROADWAY
SAN DIEGO 92101
Parking is limited, please plan to arrive early! There is no space for RV's or large vehicles.
There is also an ASA dune info meeting the weekend after, August 28th at Extreme Performance in Grand Terrace 
See here for info: http://www.americansandassociation.org/
See here for info: http://www.americansandassociation.org/
BE THERE OR BE SQUARE!
OK - First - thank you to the ASA for the Meeting and the information. I really did learn alot - and now want to learn more. I was only there for the 1st two hours and was really bummed I had to leave.. You can only stifle the kids so long before they go crazy ya know..
Lets get the bad out first - I was perplexed at the lack of turnout.
And even more amazed that the BOD thought that was a great turn out. 
I mean each week we have 3-4 times more people at any given time etc.. Dont know if its not getting the word out or what - but I was really expecting to see hundreds of people. No kidding..
That scientist dude was AWESOME - I could have listened to him talk about the life cycle of the weed for hours on end. I cant wait to get out there at the end of Oct and check out the weed - I have a new found respect for all them plants out there and the animals.
I seriously would consider (IF I WAS THE ASA) having a Conference and Debate inviting the CBD to participate - That man is so passionate about his work - it borders a certain coolness like us and our dunes. I really think you could educate the MASSES on that plant by setting something up - cause Im still wanting to hear MORE about the life cycle of the desert and that man is TOPS for that.
I was bummed at the whole Drags thing - I dont see why you even waste your time on them - Let the BLM deal with that - its what they get paid to do. This entire beer can hitting a cop um-teen years ago was a inccident that would and could happen anywhere. I just see it as a total waste of the ASAs time.
That little brochure thing was cool - but we spent way to much time talking about it. Seemed like fluff in a meeting like that - sorry - just an opinion..
Im 100% on board with Brians comments on the class L land.. I understand its an uphill battle to try and beat why the central closure/limit was closed to begin with - but arent those the battles that need to be fought. Its been uphill since inception from my understanding.
LOOK MA - I learnt something - I learned there are classes of land out there that I had no idea existed and its for ALL of CA deserts.
Class I = Intense Use
Class L = Limited Use
Class ? for the closed to all
Also found out what that whole AMA stands for also - Adaptive Management A?? It means the BLM is required to manage the L class land - And since its Adaptive - it can change and needs to change. The BLM is not working it end of the contract by not doing anything -
Thats it for now - as I stated - Im sorry I missed the afternoon classes - If Im wrong on any of the above - please refrain from callin me ignorant - and correct me is all.
Lets get the bad out first - I was perplexed at the lack of turnout.
And even more amazed that the BOD thought that was a great turn out. I mean each week we have 3-4 times more people at any given time etc.. Dont know if its not getting the word out or what - but I was really expecting to see hundreds of people. No kidding..
That scientist dude was AWESOME - I could have listened to him talk about the life cycle of the weed for hours on end. I cant wait to get out there at the end of Oct and check out the weed - I have a new found respect for all them plants out there and the animals.
I seriously would consider (IF I WAS THE ASA) having a Conference and Debate inviting the CBD to participate - That man is so passionate about his work - it borders a certain coolness like us and our dunes. I really think you could educate the MASSES on that plant by setting something up - cause Im still wanting to hear MORE about the life cycle of the desert and that man is TOPS for that.
I was bummed at the whole Drags thing - I dont see why you even waste your time on them - Let the BLM deal with that - its what they get paid to do. This entire beer can hitting a cop um-teen years ago was a inccident that would and could happen anywhere. I just see it as a total waste of the ASAs time.
That little brochure thing was cool - but we spent way to much time talking about it. Seemed like fluff in a meeting like that - sorry - just an opinion..
Im 100% on board with Brians comments on the class L land.. I understand its an uphill battle to try and beat why the central closure/limit was closed to begin with - but arent those the battles that need to be fought. Its been uphill since inception from my understanding.
LOOK MA - I learnt something - I learned there are classes of land out there that I had no idea existed and its for ALL of CA deserts.
Class I = Intense Use
Class L = Limited Use
Class ? for the closed to all
Also found out what that whole AMA stands for also - Adaptive Management A?? It means the BLM is required to manage the L class land - And since its Adaptive - it can change and needs to change. The BLM is not working it end of the contract by not doing anything -
Thats it for now - as I stated - Im sorry I missed the afternoon classes - If Im wrong on any of the above - please refrain from callin me ignorant - and correct me is all.
| QUOTE (Chummin @ Aug 22 2004, 11:18 AM) |
| Thats it for now - as I stated - Im sorry I missed the afternoon classes - If Im wrong on any of the above - please refrain from callin me ignorant - and correct me is all. |
Hey Chummin,
Remember, it was stated that the "I" word refered to not having "KNOWLEDGE"
You went, you heard, you learned.....
| QUOTE (Chummin @ Aug 22 2004, 11:18 AM) |
| That scientist dude was AWESOME |
You must be referring to Dr. Phillips... he IS awesome.
He can explain things so they make sense to everyone listening.
And he'd leave Dan-o a quivering mass of witless jello in a debate. Unfortunately I doubt we'd ever see such a thing... seems Dan-o has an aversion to standing toe-to-toe with someone who actually knows what they're talking about.
Vicki
Chummin, just a few comments on your experience at the meeting:
| QUOTE |
Lets get the bad out first - I was perplexed at the lack of turnout. And even more amazed that the BOD thought that was a great turn out. I mean each week we have 3-4 times more people at any given time etc.. Dont know if its not getting the word out or what - but I was really expecting to see hundreds of people. No kidding.. |
I've been to ASA BOD meetings and ASA Info meetings. For some reason there is never much of a turnout for the BOD meetings but the Info meetings I've been to were all standing room only at large venues. I think for some reason people are afraid that BOD meetings will be mainly "procedural" stuff about running the org and not directly dune related so they just aren't as interested.
Remember there's an Info meeting next week (IIRC) over in your neck of the woods and I would suggest checking that out as the turnout will probably be a lot more like what you expected.
Possible bummer: Then again all the meetings I've attended were in AZ. And I know a lot of people here won't like hearing this but for whatever reason the turnout to meetings in AZ always seems to be MUCH MUCH better than turnout to meetings in CA. Even meetings that hardly get publicized in AZ seem to get more people than meetings that are hyped big time in CA. Maybe it's just bad timing on the CA meetings, maybe CA people just aren't "meeting" orienated, maybe people don't like the choice of venues. I don't know, I have my own theories but they're not very popular with anyone but me
Also, I hate to even mention this but....the BOD meetings are much more formal. The info meetings are a lot more relaxed with cool sand toys on display to drool over, food for everyone, and usually even door prizes. Maybe that's what draws the people in more than the will to be informed. Personally I think both styles of meetings have their place and fill a need and would suggest attending both before making any hard decisions about the design of either style of meeting.
| QUOTE |
That scientist dude was AWESOME - I could have listened to him talk about the life cycle of the weed for hours on end. I cant wait to get out there at the end of Oct and check out the weed - I have a new found respect for all them plants out there and the animals. I seriously would consider (IF I WAS THE ASA) having a Conference and Debate inviting the CBD to participate - That man is so passionate about his work - it borders a certain coolness like us and our dunes. I really think you could educate the MASSES on that plant by setting something up - cause Im still wanting to hear MORE about the life cycle of the desert and that man is TOPS for that. |
Dr. Phillips is amazing. I've always been impressed by him at BLM meetings, ASA meetings and any other chance I've had to hear him speak. I don't know if you were aware of this or not but last year he took part in a "Rare Plants Conference" where he presented his info about the PMV along with Dan Patterson presenting the CBD's view, a researcher from CA who's being paid by the FWS to try and disprove Dr. Phillips, and the researcher for the BLM who's "studies" have been repeatedly shown as useless.
It wasn't a debate as such but it was a good chance to see all sides up in front of their peers presenting their info - and IMHO Dr. Phillips did the best job of the four. Patterson had no data just heresay, conjecture, misinformation and a few out right fabrications. The guy from CA who in the FWS delisting decision claimed Dr. Phillips didn't use a large enough study group actually relied on Dr. Phillips research to choose his own study group which is itself just a sub-set of Dr. Phillips! (So somehow this guy feels justified in criticizing Dr. Phillips for not doing a large enough survey and claiming that his own research contradicts Dr. Phillips...even though his own survey was of a sub-set of Dr. Phillips supposedly undersized study group!)
There's a discussion about this event you may have missed here:
http://www.americansandassociation.org/php...lant+conference
That discussion includes links to video of the event. The videos are HUGE I'll warn you now...but well worth it if you enjoyed listening to Dr. Phillips.
The drags, bottle incident, safety in general. Remember the lawsuit was filed by three groups: Sierra Club, CBD, and PEER. The first two were involved because of "land use" issues. The third was involved because of employee saftey for the BLM - even though the group is run by Karen Schambach and is just a front for extreme environmentalists their "public face" to congress and others is that they're there to protect government employees. They're the ones who funded this video and sent it to congress:
http://glamisonline.org/downloads/PeerVideo.rm
And don't forget Washingtons response to that bottle throwing incident that nearly ended up closing down the whole dune system:
http://biologicaldiversity.org/swcbd/golde...Dlawreport.html
This post from Vince sums a lot of the first fallout from that incident up:
http://www.americansandassociation.org/php...ghlight=#124175
I only say this to point out that the ASA didn't arbitrarially decide to make these things issues - theyr'e responding to things that the plantiffs in the lawsuit and the BLM have used to justify their actions that work against us. It's a big time case of "a few bad seeds ruining the apple" and that's why IMHO groups like the ASA need to be involved so the BLM dosn't overreact and the other groups don't have as much fuel for their fires. Unfortunatly our side can't just choose to let these things go no matter how old they are because the other side keeps bringing them back to the lawmakers to try and show how "horribly behaved" duners are to justify closing more land. I personally would love to see us not have to worry about this - but the decision is not our sides to make at this point.
As for the Land classification issues. There's more info about that if you or anyone else are interested. It was a large part of the ASA and coalition's response to the RAMP and can be found here:
ASA's own comments: http://www.americansandassociation.org/doc...IS_Comments.pdf
Coalitions comments:
http://www.americansandassociation.org/doc...IS_Comments.pdf
Without having been at this particual meeting I can't say anthing more since I'm not sure what the exact discussion you're refering to was or what Brian's comments you mentioned were
I'm glad to see you made it to a meeting and only wish I could have been there as well this time. I hope you'll at least consider attending the info meeting that's coming up in CA as I think you'll be plesently pleased by the turnout - and if not then maybe we'll at least get you on board to help make the turnout better in the future.
Dr P. had a great speech! Besides the good technical info on the PMV he mentioned many times how DP doesn't know shait from shineola and what he says and acts on is frivolous!
I wanted to say welcome to our world
The AMA is classified as Class L land. I think it was VOR that mentioned getting it changed to Class I.
Wouldn't this be a good thing?
I wanted to say welcome to our world
The AMA is classified as Class L land. I think it was VOR that mentioned getting it changed to Class I.
Wouldn't this be a good thing?
Chum,
First off, wanted to say that it was great to see that you were at the meeting. Was sitting behind you and thought your kids were very well behaved, considering how long they had to ‘sit still’ and ‘be quiet’. Can tell you’re a great dad! Am only sorry I didn’t get the chance to introduce myself. Come by camp next time we’re out there together...beer’s (at least one) is on me. 
As for turn out, can appreciate how you feel, would have liked to see a lot more too!! On the other hand, am also glad to see that there are MORE peep’s showing up!! Nest ASA BOD is in January, in Ontario. Maybe this one can get packed!!!
Phillips was great. What you said about him has already nailed it. The dude you missed after lunch was Greg Thompson from the BLM, the former head of the El Centro BLM Field Office. Us duners were sorta tuff on the guy, not REAL bad, but we kept him on the hot seat. I am not going to go into all the details of what he said right now, but there were a couple of things....
1) The BLM, in cooperation with local LEO’s is gonna be cracking down much harder on alcohol use in the dunes. In other words, don’t DRINK and DRIVE! This is a NATIONAL program, which means it is gonna happen all over the country on BLM land everywhere as well as the dunes.
2) One dude in the meeting had a REALLY awesome IDEA for the Sand Drags and for the night time ‘gatherings’ at COMP and OLDS. He suggested that the LEO’s/BLM rangers show up EARLY and help SET UP the parking lines for these things. In other words, be there BEFORE all the peeps show up. This would really help keep the ‘drunks and rowdy’ peeps away. None of them are gonna pull up and park next to Mr. Ranger LEO.
Greg Thompson didn’t take too many notes during his talk, but he wrote THAT ONE down!!
Will post more eventually. Was also great to meet The Pastor, and Mike330R. Look forward to seeing all of you again sometime.
First off, wanted to say that it was great to see that you were at the meeting. Was sitting behind you and thought your kids were very well behaved, considering how long they had to ‘sit still’ and ‘be quiet’.
Can tell you’re a great dad! Am only sorry I didn’t get the chance to introduce myself. Come by camp next time we’re out there together...beer’s (at least one) is on me. As for turn out, can appreciate how you feel, would have liked to see a lot more too!! On the other hand, am also glad to see that there are MORE peep’s showing up!! Nest ASA BOD is in January, in Ontario. Maybe this one can get packed!!!
Phillips was great. What you said about him has already nailed it. The dude you missed after lunch was Greg Thompson from the BLM, the former head of the El Centro BLM Field Office. Us duners were sorta tuff on the guy, not REAL bad, but we kept him on the hot seat. I am not going to go into all the details of what he said right now, but there were a couple of things....
1) The BLM, in cooperation with local LEO’s is gonna be cracking down much harder on alcohol use in the dunes. In other words, don’t DRINK and DRIVE! This is a NATIONAL program, which means it is gonna happen all over the country on BLM land everywhere as well as the dunes.
2) One dude in the meeting had a REALLY awesome IDEA for the Sand Drags and for the night time ‘gatherings’ at COMP and OLDS. He suggested that the LEO’s/BLM rangers show up EARLY and help SET UP the parking lines for these things. In other words, be there BEFORE all the peeps show up. This would really help keep the ‘drunks and rowdy’ peeps away. None of them are gonna pull up and park next to Mr. Ranger LEO.
Greg Thompson didn’t take too many notes during his talk, but he wrote THAT ONE down!!
Will post more eventually. Was also great to meet The Pastor, and Mike330R. Look forward to seeing all of you again sometime.
| QUOTE (L&L Corvairs @ Aug 22 2004, 11:05 PM) |
| .. The dude you missed after lunch was Greg Thompson from the BLM, the former head of the El Centro BLM Field Office. Us duners were sorta tuff on the guy, not REAL bad, but we kept him on the hot seat. ... |
That was a 'walk in the park' for Greg.
Sometimes the TRT meetings get brutal. Greg is very good at what he does and he knows that heated discussions are sometimes part of the work. As is the key in any working relationship, you have to not take things personal when they are not meant to be. Greg know this. I'm sure that's one of the reasons he was promoted. No doubt it was our loss.
I couldn't agree more about Art Phillips. He is a class act and very interesting to listen (& talk) to.
It was good to see all of you there!
I want to give my impressions of this meeting but I'll have to wait till later today... (damn work!)
But, I want to add quickly a huge thanks to Jerry Seaver and Grant George for making me and the rest of the GD.com crew feel very welcome. They went out of thier way to make sure we were at ease and that all of our questions were answered...
More later
But, I want to add quickly a huge thanks to Jerry Seaver and Grant George for making me and the rest of the GD.com crew feel very welcome. They went out of thier way to make sure we were at ease and that all of our questions were answered...
More later
Excellent info! Unfortunately, I had other chores to attend to on my only day off (like trying frantically to get my Banshee in running order by next week), so I missed the afternoon session. Hopefully I'll get a chance to attend another meeting soon and jump in a little deeper.
Grant - You don't know me, but I'm the kid that followed you into the elevator. Thanks to you and everyone else who I met that made me feel welcome, no I didn't get lost and yes, I'll be back.
Grant - You don't know me, but I'm the kid that followed you into the elevator. Thanks to you and everyone else who I met that made me feel welcome, no I didn't get lost and yes, I'll be back.
Try and make the "DUNE INFO MEETING" at Extreme Performance this weekend-you will come away with even more info and probably even have some "fun"
I haven't posted here in eons.. but I do read the BBS often.
I wanted to chime in on a few points.
I've attended 3 BOD meetings and the usual turn out is about 25. I counted 49 at at our fullest and I think we had 2 more show up after that.
The best part is usually the afternoon.. If you left early, you missed Roy (talk a mile a minute to get it all in) Denner. I do know how hard it is to get away with family and all... Chummin your kids were great..
I was so glad the GD.COM came and I look forward to hearing more comments.
The meeting can get a bit long and drawn out, but the BOD wants everyone to see what they are doing and each piece of the puzzle makes the pie. It's all part of the big PIZZA.
I am proud to be associated with such a great group of people who work HARD so my (OUR) children can have some hope of the right to ride that I grew up with.
Thank you very much Chummin and Brian for your show.. you are always welcome .. everyone is.. WE ARE ALL IN THIS TOGETHER. We are Fighting for the SAME thing...... :-) I wish EVERYONE would remember that..
I hope you all can come by the ASA Booth at the Sand Show and we hope it is a big success !!
Sue Davies
ASA BOD Meeting and Logistics Coordinator
I wanted to chime in on a few points.
I've attended 3 BOD meetings and the usual turn out is about 25. I counted 49 at at our fullest and I think we had 2 more show up after that.
The best part is usually the afternoon.. If you left early, you missed Roy (talk a mile a minute to get it all in) Denner. I do know how hard it is to get away with family and all... Chummin your kids were great..
I was so glad the GD.COM came and I look forward to hearing more comments.
The meeting can get a bit long and drawn out, but the BOD wants everyone to see what they are doing and each piece of the puzzle makes the pie. It's all part of the big PIZZA.
I am proud to be associated with such a great group of people who work HARD so my (OUR) children can have some hope of the right to ride that I grew up with.
Thank you very much Chummin and Brian for your show.. you are always welcome .. everyone is.. WE ARE ALL IN THIS TOGETHER. We are Fighting for the SAME thing...... :-) I wish EVERYONE would remember that..
I hope you all can come by the ASA Booth at the Sand Show and we hope it is a big success !!
Sue Davies
ASA BOD Meeting and Logistics Coordinator
Hi Susan,
Are you or someone, going to post the minutes from the meeting ?
If so, when and where ???
| QUOTE (SOUTHERN BOY @ Aug 23 2004, 02:15 PM) |
| Hi Susan, Are you or someone, going to post the minutes from the meeting ? If so, when and where ??? |
SB,
I do not know.
. BUT I will find out and post when I do. THANK YOU, I will watch for your reply ..
Welcome over to GD.COM
HOT DARN, SLAP SURE DO LOVE TO SEE FOLKS FROM DIFFERENT NEIGHBORHOODS GATHER TOGETHER FOR A RAP SESSION ... Definitely gotta have more of them...
HMMM, do ya think if Daniel Patterson showed up we could turn him into a duner??? AHA HA HA HA HA...LET SLAP WORK ON HIM A LITTLE ...
Lookin forward to seein da minutes.
... Definitely gotta have more of them...HMMM, do ya think if Daniel Patterson showed up we could turn him into a duner??? AHA HA HA HA HA...LET SLAP WORK ON HIM A LITTLE
...Lookin forward to seein da minutes.
HEY MR. SLAPPY,
IT'S ALWAYS AN HONOR TO HEAR FROM YA....
I AM LEAVING ON THAT TRIP TO THE SOUTH NEXT WEEK -- I WILL REMEMBER
TO TELL YOUR RELATIVES HELLO FOR YOU.
"HAVE A GREAT DAY"
The minunts will be posted after they have been approved by the BOD. it usually takes until the next BOD conference call for everyone to review,have changes made and vote to approve the minutes.
I do want to thank Julie Krogh for taking the minutes during the meetings it has been a great help to me in getting them to the BOD in a timely manner.
Cricket Sankovich
ASA Board Member / Sec.
I do want to thank Julie Krogh for taking the minutes during the meetings it has been a great help to me in getting them to the BOD in a timely manner.
Cricket Sankovich
ASA Board Member / Sec.
I just found a few minutes to respond.
Thanks to all you guys that came out. We were very happy to see that many people. Take what you learned and share with your friends. Hopefully they will come out and support us next time.
A couple specific comments
The Safe Duning Brochure , 24 pages full color and bound . When it first came up a few of us felt like Chummi... kind of cool but shouldn’t we be doing something else. As it started taking shape the OHV orgs support , business community contacts ,networking and agency support has been unreal. It’s been a huge revenue generator(money for the fight.).
As a direct result of this project there should be an announcement at the SSSS of significant on the ground resources for the ISDRA that would of otherwise user fees would have been paying for . In other words deliverables.
Art Phillips… Awesome guy, nobody knows more about the PMV than this man.
Roy Denner ..Glad he is on our side and a team player. Proud to work side by side with him .
Greg Thompsen .. Always in a tough spot, as usual handled himself with dignity.
AMA… ASA will not give up. Read our RAMP comments …. We will not give up.
ASA BOD and Committee chairs/volunteers…. My hats off to you
Take what you learned and remember INFORM, UNITE and MOBILIZE
Just a note Grant,
I feel the brochure was very valuable - Its a cool deal and to have it delivered with products is way cool - Just felt the description of it and stuff that made it happen seemed to carry on was all. I was still on the technical frame of mind when that came up.. Kind of glossed my eyes over.
I feel the brochure was very valuable - Its a cool deal and to have it delivered with products is way cool - Just felt the description of it and stuff that made it happen seemed to carry on was all. I was still on the technical frame of mind when that came up.. Kind of glossed my eyes over.
Chummin , I understand how you feel. The team that put that together worked on it for nearly 9months and that is there forum to show the results. The final had just showed up the day before.
Anyway thanks for coming out.
Anyway thanks for coming out.
One more benefit. Any Newbie duners will get a ton of good info out of it
Oh yeah - Hey Grant - how do I go about getting a small number of those - Like around 100 or so? We can talk later on this as well.
| QUOTE (Chummin @ Aug 25 2004, 09:49 AM) |
| Oh yeah - Hey Grant - how do I go about getting a small number of those - Like around 100 or so? We can talk later on this as well. |
Chummin,
Jerry Seaver had a list of folks he was going to send some too.. I asked for 100. If you want to email me and tell me how many you would like and where to send to.. I can forward to Jerry.. or you can email him directly... You may already have his contact info. Either way, Let me know if I can help.
Acct@cymsandiego.com - my email
For anyone who wants the new Brochures they will be available at the ASA Booth at the SSSS. I will bring a bit over 100 home with me for any needs here in San Diego and I can always get more and deliver if needed.
I've already forwarded Rob info in response to his email. :-)
Jerry Seaver and Bob Mason are excited to see interest :-) They've put a lot of work into it.
I've already forwarded Rob info in response to his email. :-)
Jerry Seaver and Bob Mason are excited to see interest :-) They've put a lot of work into it.
Myself, my grandfather and uncle will be at the ASA meeting Tomorrow at the Extreme shop.
Hope to see you guys there
Hope to see you guys there
Just curious ------ any minutes as of yet ?? Where they approved ???
"HAVE A GREAT WEEKEND"
Did anyone go to the meeting today? i was there and we didn't have a very good turnout.
Southern Boy Asked
| QUOTE |
| Just curious ------ any minutes as of yet ?? Where they approved ??? |
I've just sent them to all of the Board Members for their review - they won't be approved until the BOD has had time to review them and then vote for approval.
Here is the new safeduning brochure for anyone interested.
http://www.glamisonline.org/SafeDuning.shtml
I am not sure how to paste links.. hope it works.. BBS ADMIN if you want to fix for me if it does not work
Thanks
http://www.glamisonline.org/SafeDuning.shtml
I am not sure how to paste links.. hope it works.. BBS ADMIN if you want to fix for me if it does not work
Thanks
Looks well done! Lots of info in there....
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