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X3 or XX?


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Not that I don’t have enough irons in the fire right now, but I’ve been thinking about maybe next year getting a UTV for my daughter & her older cousin to use. 
 

The two 2022 cars I would look at are the Can Am X3 DS 64 inch or the Arctic Cat XX. Both the DS & XX are 64 inch cars, and in the $21k range. Any car purchased would get better seats, seat belts, radio/intercom and window nets are mandatory, not and option. It’s about safety! 
 

Option 1. X3 DS                                            X3 DS Pros: stable company, & dealer support. Rotax engine, do I need to say more! Now 200hp, 102wb. 
X3 DS cons: need to replace cage and add suspension gusset kit. Figure out how to carry a spare tire. Add door inserts. Would need to make custom opening window nets. Driver Visibility is not the best, especially for newbies. 
 

Option 2. XX.                                          XX Pros. Chassis & cage don’t need upgrades or replacing. Good stout suspension, that you don’t hear about failing. I like the suspension design better. Full doors factory. Spare tire mount built in. Window nets kit is easy to get from Speed. 
XX cons: company's future & dealer support questionable? Not a fan of the high rev Yamaha engine. Can’t buy the base model and get the new better clutch (stupid!) Heat in the cab is a common complaint and would have to be fixed. 
 

Being that we mostly do trips to Superstition and do more a hard pack, big HP is not a requirement. Plus this car is for younger kids, and a starter car. So even 130hp would be more then enough power.  It’s more about having a safe car for them, not the fastest. Both brands have a good history of not having recalls or manufacturing issues. The Can Am will cost more upfront with having to replace the cage & added the suspension gusset kit. But should have a better overall resale value with the increased hp, being a Turbo and being part of a stable company like BRP. The XX should be cheaper out of the box and seems to have less design flaws vs the X3. But resale value is questionable depending on the future of Arctic Cat, and low sales numbers.  

Option 3 is just keep the Polaris XP4 900 I have, and let them drive that? Pros, it’s free, and done up really nice already. Cons, only 90hp, and they might feel the need to push it harder to make a hill or keep up. Not good when learning. I can make 90hp work as I understand momentum and how to use it. They don’t need the back seats. I’d have to get custom window nets made for it, and like the X3 that could be costly. 

Between these two models, the X3 or XX which would you consider and feel safer for your kids? Remember this is for your kids, not you. Or just go with option 3? 
 

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Edited by NIKAL
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For me if you can swing it financially it would be a no-brainer to do the X3. The motor alone is so much nicer than that screamer in the Wildcat. Lots of cars out there running with the factory cage. I run mine that way in the desert. Spare tire is easy if you don't mind going a little higher than the roof of the car. You just mount it up high on the back bar.

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I bought this tire mount. It is a nice piece. Only pic I have of my car showing the spare tire. Personally I like the stock 30" Bighorns in the desert. At 12 psi they have held up in some hard rocky driving but not getting completely stupid. I bought a full set of 4 takeoffs for $150 and two of them were 80% plus. If we do a long trip I bring an extra spare or two on top of the one on the car. Still have not lost or put a hole in a tire. Oh and I have had a 900 as well. Not even close compared to what the x3 can do vs what it could do in the desert. Complete different world. 

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Edited by onanysunday
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58 minutes ago, onanysunday said:

For me if you can swing it financially it would be a no-brainer to do the X3. The motor alone is so much nicer than that screamer in the Wildcat. Lots of cars out there running with the factory cage. I run mine that way in the desert. Spare tire is easy if you don't mind going a little higher than the roof of the car. You just mount it up high on the back bar.

Both models are in the $21k price range. That’s one of the reasons I could compare these two cars, as they are both 64 inch and priced the same. The biggest lure for me on the X3 is the Rotax engine and Can Am drivetrain. Biggest loser for me on the XX is the Yamaha. Not because it’s not a reliable engine, because I t is. But just for the fact it’s high reving. 
 

 The stock cage on the X3 is not a option for me, the kids and safety. Also not a fan of mounting the spare tire so high. Not saying it does not work, just not for me. 
 

Can’t argue about the Bighorn as I do think it’s a good all around tire. They are light, the lug pattern acts as a paddle in the soft sand, yet is comfortable in the hard pack. Reminds me of the old Desert Trac tire everyone ran in the 80’s on their buggy’s. But as HP & speed has grown, so has the need for more durable more puncture resistant tires. But those tires have trade offs and are mostly good for one application, where the Bighorn is decent in several applications. 

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You read the internet too much IMO. The stock Can Am cage isn't a safety issue and I would have no problem putting any of my family members in a car with a stock cage. Secondly you do not need to put a gusset kit in either. You act like the front end will fold up at the first bump it hits. Lastly, the stock harnesses are actually really good and also don't need replacing. As far a spare tire option, Extreme performance makes a nice rear bumper / spare tire holder that holds the tire on the rear deck. 

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How old are the kids that would be driving this new SXS?

 

The X3 motor and drive train can not be beat for reliability.   I would also tell you to spend a few grand more and get the 72" model X3 that comes with the QS3 shocks.  The added width makes the car even more stable.

As far as spare tire carrier I have had several on my X3.  With a stock cage the Can Am pivot rack is the great.  If you go aftermarket cage both Assault Industries and Cognito Motorsports make really nice racks that pivot up and leave room for a storage underneath the rack.

I am not sure you would need a gusset kit for the 64" model.   My friend never put one on his 64" model and never had any issues.  He sold his care with 4,000 or so miles on it.   All he did was desert and some trail riding.   If you do go with a gusset kit you do not have to go nuts.  After 8,000 miles on my last X3 my cheap HMF gusset kit help up great.  By the way the 2022 X3 increased the material thickness in the front bulkhead area and were the suspension mounts. So gusset kit would not be a top priority.  If you are insistent on an aftermarket cage   Cagewrx makes a great aftermarket cage that is very reasonable price wise.  If you can weld the the weld it yourself kit is around $800 with an aluminum roof.   

You can buy seat risers for the X3 that lift up the rear of the seat so you can see more.  The stock retractable harnesses work really well.   Only reason I got rid of mine is because the did not work with the seats I purchased.   The stock seats are pretty comfortable. 

The Wildcat XX is a great car and works great in the desert.  The rear suspension likes to buck and bottom out.  A spring kit helps.  They are built pretty tough.  Visibility in the XX is not much better than the X3.   I have friends with the XX and they appear to be problem free.  I would think you could work a good deal on a XX as they do not sell very well.   

My only concern with the XX would be the lack of dealers and if you need any warranty work.

If speed is not a concern I would also be looking at the Kawi KRX.   

 

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Get a Canned Ham if you're gonna be in Glamis... you'll want/need that HP. They do well out there even running on stock dirt tires... I think that turbo is 186hp.... I think my Velocity is 168hp.

My $.02

abc

PS. Maybe buy one a year or two old... someone that wants to 'move up' to the Speed maybe...?

Edited by ANGRYBUTTCRACK
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3 minutes ago, ANGRYBUTTCRACK said:

Get a Canned Ham if you're gonna be in Glamis... you'll want/need that HP. They do well out there even running on stock dirt tires... I think that turbo is 186hp.... I think my Velocity is 168hp.

My $.02

abc

PS. Maybe buy one a year or two old... someone that wants to 'move up' to the Speed maybe...?

With the used prices I would get a new one.  Especially with the upgrades Can Am did to the frame for 2022.  Plus the RR models are all 200hp.  

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The two biggest draw backs I see to the XX is lack of dealer support it is horrible and heat in the cab we have an 18 and overall it has done pretty good, I have always thought some thing was wrong with the clutch and have done a Speedwerx’s clutch kit seemed to help. The pros and cons of both you stated are pretty much right on. From resale I think you are better off with the CanAm. Owning the XX I would not hesitate buying another if I was looking there is a lot I like about it. I buy most of my parts from Rocky Mountain ATV they have reasonable availability, not sure how far you are from a dealer for each but that would be a deciding factor for me. When we bought the XX the dealer was only about 45 , 50 min away the owner passed away shortly after we bought it now the closest good dealer is 3.5 hours away and that sucks. I do all of our own work so other than warranty issues and parts it isn’t that big of a deal. That being said if I were to buy now I would go with the CanAm over XX just because of dealer location we have a CanAm dealer in town.                                       Good luck with your decision 

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I would say that the cage doesn’t seem to be to much of a concern, it’s just the rest of the frame.😳 Pretty impressed how the cage held up from this picture. Kids are involved so you know they will at times push the limits on these things or run out of talent. Safety is number 1 concern. I also think that  the KRX should be and option if not running in the sand to much. Can always turbo it later for the added power?? 
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That's not the only one. If I even remotely considered a Canam, the first thing I'd do is replace the chassis with the Geiser bros. chassis. But then you'd have close to $45k into it, which makes the Speed UTV a better value. Between a stock Canam and XX, the XX is built way better, a lot stronger. That is unless safety is not really a concern.

 

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Edited by Lord of the Dunes
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I’m a Polaris owner… but Glamis… Canned Ham is better… they’re ‘low slung’ and don’t have the body roll that the RZR has…

.. that’s why I have that off-road jack… wouldn’t even fit underneath his Canned Ham.. so I bought it from him…

 

 

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The bottom pic is kind of puzzling. I'm trying to figure out why the front suspension collapsed like it did. I don't see any big boulders or jumps behind the wreckage, so it appears that the front suspension broke due to prior damage that occurred somewhere else, then it just gave out here, on a fairly smooth trail. 

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3 hours ago, Hondajimz said:

You read the internet too much IMO.

I'm a sandrail guy. A glamis guy. ONLY. Plenty of folks love their jet boats, street rods, muscle cars, sports cars, supercars, sail boats etc. I really don't invest too much time in those arenas. Although I do want a Wake Boat but 6 figures to make a wave? Wowsers

With that being said, I know, love and study sand cars from any era. Who built what, how they perform, powerplant/driveline options etc. How's about this, the first legit long travel sand car was built by John at Playtech Racing. I'm not talking about a desert car with sand tires bolted on, a TRUE sandrail. While the I Beam front end wasn't the best performing, it opened up the eyes of the industry to what could be done. Also, how did we end up with huge horsepower V8s? It began when Mendeola released his brainchild. Up until that point we ran swing axles or Bus Boxes. And the bus boxes UPSIDE down in a mid engine application to make the car go forward! Mendeola transaxles could hold up to  higher HP numbers and abuse, then guys started experimenting with different engine combos. We landed on the Northstar V8. Why? Because they are affordable. That morphed into better tranny designs, bigger engines and more structurally sound chassis. So from pan buggies (all those poor hacked up 1950s VWs!) and water pumpers, to the era of 2000hp long travel cars and everything in between, I've got a handle on em. And for arguments sake, the Georges build the BEST performing SAND CAR in the dunes. Just sayin. 

Now. What I know of current sport SXSs is this...

 RZRs burn to the ground, have a Crap ton of recalls and come from the factory already broken. But they have great visibility and suspension. 

X3s front ends wad up and need bracing if driven hard or raced, plus have poor "look over" visibility. The 4 seater has a longer wheelbase than a Chevy Suburban (WOW!)

YXZs are fast, but ride like Crap.

KRX quality is fantastic, and the car is beefy. But slow as Crap

Tomcar. Probably the best out of all SXSs but ugly as sin

Arctic cat/Textron SS, epic car, designed by Gordon, but the company is a Crap show

And then there's the car i want. The new Gordon SPEED SXS. Why? Um, because a Baja race team is designing/building the car. Everybody's upset at the wait, but you're not going to get a better SXS from ANY manufacturer. So my money goes to SPEED UTV. 

I have followed and read every post in the Speed SXS thread, NIKAL has the best input, information, experience and opinions of anybody on GD.com, although I particularly enjoy reading BUFFS posts and LOL as he gets everyone's panties n a wad. He does make some good points. 

THANK YOU Nikal for studying the SXS market, so guys like me that don't invest the time, effort and energy into that market (to me, SXSs are "throw away" machines) can make a well informed decision.

Nikal, as far as your predicament? I'd go with the Can Am. The XX, while an amazing car, is going the way of the Daewoo automobile...

 

 

 

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1 hour ago, Conrad said:

I'm a sandrail guy. A glamis guy. ONLY. Plenty of folks love their jet boats, street rods, muscle cars, sports cars, supercars, sail boats etc. I really don't invest too much time in those arenas. Although I do want a Wake Boat but 6 figures to make a wave? Wowsers

With that being said, I know, love and study sand cars from any era. Who built what, how they perform, powerplant/driveline options etc. How's about this, the first legit long travel sand car was built by John at Playtech Racing. I'm not talking about a desert car with sand tires bolted on, a TRUE sandrail. While the I Beam front end wasn't the best performing, it opened up the eyes of the industry to what could be done. Also, how did we end up with huge horsepower V8s? It began when Mendeola released his brainchild. Up until that point we ran swing axles or Bus Boxes. And the bus boxes UPSIDE down in a mid engine application to make the car go forward! Mendeola transaxles could hold up to  higher HP numbers and abuse, then guys started experimenting with different engine combos. We landed on the Northstar V8. Why? Because they are affordable. That morphed into better tranny designs, bigger engines and more structurally sound chassis. So from pan buggies (all those poor hacked up 1950s VWs!) and water pumpers, to the era of 2000hp long travel cars and everything in between, I've got a handle on em. And for arguments sake, the Georges build the BEST performing SAND CAR in the dunes. Just sayin. 

Now. What I know of current sport SXSs is this...

 RZRs burn to the ground, have a Crap ton of recalls and come from the factory already broken. But they have great visibility and suspension. 

X3s front ends wad up and need bracing if driven hard or raced, plus have poor "look over" visibility. The 4 seater has a longer wheelbase than a Chevy Suburban (WOW!)

YXZs are fast, but ride like Crap.

KRX quality is fantastic, and the car is beefy. But slow as Crap

Tomcar. Probably the best out of all SXSs but ugly as sin

Arctic cat/Textron SS, epic car, designed by Gordon, but the company is a Crap show

And then there's the car i want. The new Gordon SPEED SXS. Why? Um, because a Baja race team is designing/building the car. Everybody's upset at the wait, but you're not going to get a better SXS from ANY manufacturer. So my money goes to SPEED UTV. 

I have followed and read every post in the Speed SXS thread, NIKAL has the best input, information, experience and opinions of anybody on GD.com, although I particularly enjoy reading BUFFS posts and LOL as he gets everyone's panties n a wad. He does make some good points. 

THANK YOU Nikal for studying the SXS market, so guys like me that don't invest the time, effort and energy into that market (to me, SXSs are "throw away" machines) can make a well informed decision.

Nikal, as far as your predicament? I'd go with the Can Am. The XX, while an amazing car, is going the way of the Daewoo automobile...

 

 

 

I just had to say very good read. 

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5 hours ago, Hondajimz said:

You read the internet too much IMO. The stock Can Am cage isn't a safety issue and I would have no problem putting any of my family members in a car with a stock cage. Secondly you do not need to put a gusset kit in either. You act like the front end will fold up at the first bump it hits. Lastly, the stock harnesses are actually really good and also don't need replacing. As far a spare tire option, Extreme performance makes a nice rear bumper / spare tire holder that holds the tire on the rear deck. 

I also stayed at a Holiday Inn too! Lol. 
 

At first I was listening and giving you cred, as I’ve seen allot of your posts and you know the sport, and I respect that. So stock cage, maybe I can see someone saying stock is fine. Id never run or have my family ride in a stock cage, but some do. The Can Am gusset kit not needed? Ok, I’m sure many dont, but we also ha e seen allot of X3’s with the front suspension peeled back too! 
 

But when you said stock seat belts are good, you lost me! I’m a 3rd generation off road racer. My grandfather was racing the Mexican 1000 in the 70’s. So I’ve been around a bit. No way in hell would I let me kids or friends get in a off road vehicle with the stock DOT belts these vehicles come with. 
 

I also would consider Sand Shark the resident Can Am guru. He’s said cages & gusset kits are a good thing on the X3. When it comes to the X3 I’d listen and respect his advice. But I ignore him when it comes to the Speed car as he does not know Sh!t. Lol! 

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After seeing @Lord of the Dunes pictures of the same can-am, looks like that cage broke as well as the entire car. I would have to say just get a base Speed SXS. By the time you do all the work and invest all that money on a KRX or something else you could have a Speed car with Better EVERYTHING for 30k. 

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How quickly this turned into a need for “Speed”, you can’t buy a Speed car (well you can buy one just can’t drive one)so quit mentioning it, back to the topic of which car to buy, by the way which seat belts do you run in your everyday driver that will do 100 mph? Factory DOT? I know, I know it’s much safer to drive on roads and Highways. 

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23 minutes ago, DOGGY said:

How quickly this turned into a need for “Speed”, you can’t buy a Speed car (well you can buy one just can’t drive one)so quit mentioning it, back to the topic of which car to buy, by the way which seat belts do you run in your everyday driver that will do 100 mph? Factory DOT? I know, I know it’s much safer to drive on roads and Highways. 

In the OP's post, he said he was looking to buy something NEXT YEAR. For his kids.

You can put your kids in whatever you want, but I like my kids. So that's NO on the CrushedCan.

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6 hours ago, Sand Shark said:

How old are the kids that would be driving this new SXS?

 

The X3 motor and drive train can not be beat for reliability.   I would also tell you to spend a few grand more and get the 72" model X3 that comes with the QS3 shocks.  The added width makes the car even more stable.

As far as spare tire carrier I have had several on my X3.  With a stock cage the Can Am pivot rack is the great.  If you go aftermarket cage both Assault Industries and Cognito Motorsports make really nice racks that pivot up and leave room for a storage underneath the rack.

I am not sure you would need a gusset kit for the 64" model.   My friend never put one on his 64" model and never had any issues.  He sold his care with 4,000 or so miles on it.   All he did was desert and some trail riding.   If you do go with a gusset kit you do not have to go nuts.  After 8,000 miles on my last X3 my cheap HMF gusset kit help up great.  By the way the 2022 X3 increased the material thickness in the front bulkhead area and were the suspension mounts. So gusset kit would not be a top priority.  If you are insistent on an aftermarket cage   Cagewrx makes a great aftermarket cage that is very reasonable price wise.  If you can weld the the weld it yourself kit is around $800 with an aluminum roof.   

You can buy seat risers for the X3 that lift up the rear of the seat so you can see more.  The stock retractable harnesses work really well.   Only reason I got rid of mine is because the did not work with the seats I purchased.   The stock seats are pretty comfortable. 

The Wildcat XX is a great car and works great in the desert.  The rear suspension likes to buck and bottom out.  A spring kit helps.  They are built pretty tough.  Visibility in the XX is not much better than the X3.   I have friends with the XX and they appear to be problem free.  I would think you could work a good deal on a XX as they do not sell very well.   

My only concern with the XX would be the lack of dealers and if you need any warranty work.

If speed is not a concern I would also be looking at the Kawi KRX.   

 

The kids are 12 & 16. I know it sounds young. My daughter being the younger, I’ve been teaching her last year to drive the 900. She probably not gone over 30mph, as I’m more teaching her car control and wheel placement in turns and how to read the terrain. She would never drive without me in any car. She’s been riding quads since she was 3. She learned on a 86 Suzuki LT50. Awesome and fast little quad! She’s also been karting a few times a year for the past couple years. More of me training her car control and cornering. 
 

The 16 year old has been riding quads, driving her parents RZR 1000 a little bit fir a few years. It’s how she learned ti drive. Now she’s licensed and drives a car daily. 
 

If I bought new or let them use the 900, the 16 year old would drive the group rides, (daytime only) with the younger in the passenger seat. Until she got a bit older and I felt she could drive at a higher speed and in more then just the flats and mud hills with dad. 
 

Both girls are due for a quad upgrade next year and why I was thinking about getting them in a cage. Plus my daughter keeps asking when can I drive the buggy. My daughter would move up to a 250, with the teenager getting a 450. Im still not comfortable with them riding to far away from camp or with the group as you can’t control the others riding around you.  
 

Your right  about the 72 inch. I think in the 22 Can Am thread I said the best bang for the buck is the 72 inch RS, but it’s several thousand more then the 64 and if I did this it’s more of an entry level car for them to use and learn with. Again this is just me thinking about, if I was to get them a car. The dads think it’s a great idea, the mom’s think it’s dumb and I’m nuts for even considering. Lol! 
 

3 years old doing circles around camp. 

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Good prospective of the 3 year old on the 50 and 8 year old on a 70.  

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Edited by NIKAL
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22 minutes ago, Lord of the Dunes said:

In the OP's post, he said he was looking to buy something NEXT YEAR. For his kids.

You can put your kids in whatever you want, but I like my kids. So that's NO on the CrushedCan.

Yes if I bought something it would be more entry level base model. I’m trying to keeP it affordable and justifiable. HP is not a concern and why I could just let them use the XP4 900. We are not Sand Dune only people. In fact my daughter has seen Glamis & the Imperial Sand Dunes, but she’s only ridden in the Superstition dunes, which is a spit of sand compared to Glamis. Also this could be a car that guest could use and try. 
 

Thsts why the XX was being considered, as it’s a nice strong machine with many of the safety items I’d need and things like opening window nets is a internet click away, where with the Can Am I’d have to have a set fabbed up. 

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Just now, NIKAL said:

Yes if I bought something it would be more entry level base model. I’m trying to keeP it affordable and justifiable. HP is not a concern and why I could just let them use the XP4 900. We are not Sand Dune only people. In fact my daughter has seen Glamis & the Imperial Sand Dunes, but she’s only ridden in the Superstition dunes, which is a spit of sand compared to Glamis. Also this could be a car that guest could use and try. 
 

Thsts why the XX was being considered, as it’s a nice strong machine with many of the safety items I’d need and things like opening window nets is a internet click away, where with the Can Am I’d have to have a set fabbed up. 

I also like the XX, and I just don't worry too much about future factory support, I tend to go aftermarket or to my local fab shop if I need repairs, since I tend to upgrade rather than replace with the same subpar part.

Have you considered the KRX? Justin from Shock Therapy ranked it right up there with the XX, did a YT video about it. Although I wouldn't do business with him, he does know his way around all of the different SxSs.

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2 hours ago, Lord of the Dunes said:

I also like the XX, and I just don't worry too much about future factory support, I tend to go aftermarket or to my local fab shop if I need repairs, since I tend to upgrade rather than replace with the same subpar part.

Have you considered the KRX? Justin from Shock Therapy ranked it right up there with the XX, did a YT video about it. Although I wouldn't do business with him, he does know his way around all of the different SxSs.

Honestly I did not and maybe should? We have a KRX in our group. It’s nice and I think the base model is around 20K maybe I need to consider or add it to the list. 
 

Honestly if or when the time comes I will probably look at the X3, XX and KRX to see who’s got the best price and what fits the girls the best. The only thing about the KRX is it looks huge. It stands tall and with the rear fenders so high, it just looks massive and might be intimidating.? Going from a XP900 to KRX is like a Suzuki Samurai to Chevy Tahoe. 
 

One other thing that had me thinking about a car for the kids is. Im probably going to have to get a new utility trailer as the Speed UTV is longer and if I did upgrade my daughter to a bigger quad, it’s not all going to fit. So if I’m upgrading the trailer, then I might think about one that can fit two cars. This is just a domino effect, one thing leads to another. 

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