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onanysunday

SxS for desert and mountains only? - And what is my 900 worth

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1 hour ago, onanysunday said:

 that car is a demo unit with 300 miles on it. Out the door 21000 even. I might stick with a used unit and not have all the handling and tax

Here are my thoughts on this.

I agree with everyone else, with a little bit of tweaking, you could really make that 900 do anything in the dirt. If you put lighter 29" tires and a long travel kit on it, you'd probably like the ride a lot more.  You probably have all of the power you need, but if you needed a bit more, just increasing the boost a little would cure that.

What we seem to have here is a strong itch to upgrade to something newer, but save money by buying a used one. Here are my thoughts on Wildcats, both X and XX. The XX is a great riding and handling machine, nice and durable. If you think you're going to drive it like Robby Gordon, then it is the right machine for you. It handles great, rides great and it's easier to access the engine. But the Wildcat X is pretty much the same, except for the extreme durability easy engine access. I think a good suspension tuning could make an X ride just as well as a XX.

However, on paper, it's only advantage over a Wildcat X is more power. It doesn't have any more travel, and Pace makes stronger A-arms and rear arms for the Wildcat X that pretty much make it tough enough for most people. What I'm driving at is I'm also interested in the Wildcat XX, but I don't feel it's that much better than my Wildcat until it comes with a turbo engine. At that point, I'll get one.

Right now, there are probably a few Wildcat Xs on fire sale out there. I've seen some all decked out with lights, harnesses, upgrades, etc. that cost the owner probably $20k or more to piece together and they're letting them go for $8K or 9K. Worst case scenario, you sell yours for $10K, buy an X for $9K and you're $1K ahead, with 18" of travel. The X has enough power for the dirt but if you want more, throw a $4k turbo kit on it and you've got more travel and more power than a XX for less than a used one. Just another way of looking at your options.

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one thing to consider is weight, that wildcat xx is about 500# heavier than your 900, 250# ish heavier than an x3rs

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2 hours ago, socaldmax said:

Here are my thoughts on this.

I agree with everyone else, with a little bit of tweaking, you could really make that 900 do anything in the dirt. If you put lighter 29" tires and a long travel kit on it, you'd probably like the ride a lot more.  You probably have all of the power you need, but if you needed a bit more, just increasing the boost a little would cure that.

What we seem to have here is a strong itch to upgrade to something newer, but save money by buying a used one. Here are my thoughts on Wildcats, both X and XX. The XX is a great riding and handling machine, nice and durable. If you think you're going to drive it like Robby Gordon, then it is the right machine for you. It handles great, rides great and it's easier to access the engine. But the Wildcat X is pretty much the same, except for the extreme durability easy engine access. I think a good suspension tuning could make an X ride just as well as a XX.

However, on paper, it's only advantage over a Wildcat X is more power. It doesn't have any more travel, and Pace makes stronger A-arms and rear arms for the Wildcat X that pretty much make it tough enough for most people. What I'm driving at is I'm also interested in the Wildcat XX, but I don't feel it's that much better than my Wildcat until it comes with a turbo engine. At that point, I'll get one.

Right now, there are probably a few Wildcat Xs on fire sale out there. I've seen some all decked out with lights, harnesses, upgrades, etc. that cost the owner probably $20k or more to piece together and they're letting them go for $8K or 9K. Worst case scenario, you sell yours for $10K, buy an X for $9K and you're $1K ahead, with 18" of travel. The X has enough power for the dirt but if you want more, throw a $4k turbo kit on it and you've got more travel and more power than a XX for less than a used one. Just another way of looking at your options.

My dad has a 4 seat Wildcat X now and had a 2 seater.  Both of those cars ride way nicer than my XP.  But badly under powered and feel like a turd compared to my car.

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I'm gonna throw this out there...............cause I got nothin....and a 2012 900.......

 

All the cool kids have new SxS's ....  just sayin.

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The Wildcat XX would not be my choice for a car you want to play with in the rocks.  The overhang off the back is just asking to be hit when coming down or going up steep rocks. 

If it were me I would be looking at either the Polaris XP1000 rock edition ( or the 120hp Can Am 64" wide RC.   Both come with 30" tires and winches.  Better skid plates also.   The Polaris has 55% lower gearing

 

https://rzr.polaris.com/en-us/rzr-xp-1000-eps-trails-rocks-edition/

 

https://can-am.brp.com/off-road/side-by-side/maverick-x3/maverick-x3-x-rc-turbo.html

 

I would not dump any more money into the XP900.   Throwing long travel on to it or doing shock work is not going to improve the short wheelbase and the car still will not ride as nice as the XP1000 or X3 RC.  

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On 12/28/2018 at 2:23 PM, socaldmax said:

Here are my thoughts on this.

I agree with everyone else, with a little bit of tweaking, you could really make that 900 do anything in the dirt. If you put lighter 29" tires and a long travel kit on it, you'd probably like the ride a lot more.  You probably have all of the power you need, but if you needed a bit more, just increasing the boost a little would cure that.

What we seem to have here is a strong itch to upgrade to something newer, but save money by buying a used one. Here are my thoughts on Wildcats, both X and XX. The XX is a great riding and handling machine, nice and durable. If you think you're going to drive it like Robby Gordon, then it is the right machine for you. It handles great, rides great and it's easier to access the engine. But the Wildcat X is pretty much the same, except for the extreme durability easy engine access. I think a good suspension tuning could make an X ride just as well as a XX.

However, on paper, it's only advantage over a Wildcat X is more power. It doesn't have any more travel, and Pace makes stronger A-arms and rear arms for the Wildcat X that pretty much make it tough enough for most people. What I'm driving at is I'm also interested in the Wildcat XX, but I don't feel it's that much better than my Wildcat until it comes with a turbo engine. At that point, I'll get one.

Right now, there are probably a few Wildcat Xs on fire sale out there. I've seen some all decked out with lights, harnesses, upgrades, etc. that cost the owner probably $20k or more to piece together and they're letting them go for $8K or 9K. Worst case scenario, you sell yours for $10K, buy an X for $9K and you're $1K ahead, with 18" of travel. The X has enough power for the dirt but if you want more, throw a $4k turbo kit on it and you've got more travel and more power than a XX for less than a used one. Just another way of looking at your options.

The Wildcat X is not a great car and the last thing I would put any money into.    Every single person I ride with that has owned a Wildcat X has replaced a motor.  They all leak oil and several of them the starter motor teeth got chewed up.  The components are not going to last very long either.   There are only 2 Wildcat Xs left in our group and both would ditch them in a heart beat to get something else.  

Throwing a turbo on a Wildcat X motor is just asking for ruined trips and headaches.  The suspension on the Wildcat X is nice, but it is not better than the XP1000 or X3.  

The Wildcat XX is 100% better and build 100% better than the AC Wildcat X.   In the desert and trails it has plenty of power, in the dunes it lacks the power when you have factory turbo cars out there.  

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6 minutes ago, Sand Shark said:

The Wildcat X is not a great car and the last thing I would put any money into.    Every single person I ride with that has owned a Wildcat X has replaced a motor.  They all leak oil and several of them the starter motor teeth got chewed up.  The components are not going to last very long either.   There are only 2 Wildcat Xs left in our group and both would ditch them in a heart beat to get something else.  

Throwing a turbo on a Wildcat X motor is just asking for ruined trips and headaches.  The suspension on the Wildcat X is nice, but it is not better than the XP1000 or X3.  

The Wildcat XX is 100% better and build 100% better than the AC Wildcat X.   In the desert and trails it has plenty of power, in the dunes it lacks the power when you have factory turbo cars out there.  

He was asking about a SxS for dirt only, not Glamis. While I agree the XX is built better, that's at the expense of an extra 500 lbs. There's something to be said for a vehicle of the same size but 500 lbs lighter - it's going to be more nimble. 

Maybe we're thinking of different types of dirt driving. I'm thinking of medium speed/high speed trail riding and slow rock crawling. If you're thinking of Baja 500 type driving, then I'd opt for the XX. For medium or slow speed stuff, an X could work just fine. 

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6 minutes ago, socaldmax said:

He was asking about a SxS for dirt only, not Glamis. While I agree the XX is built better, that's at the expense of an extra 500 lbs. There's something to be said for a vehicle of the same size but 500 lbs lighter - it's going to be more nimble. 

Maybe we're thinking of different types of dirt driving. I'm thinking of medium speed/high speed trail riding and slow rock crawling. If you're thinking of Baja 500 type driving, then I'd opt for the XX. For medium or slow speed stuff, an X could work just fine. 

The Wildcat X would still be my last choice for dirt or trail riding just from a reliability stand point.  You are not gaining much going from a XP900 to a Wildcat X for trail and dirt riding.  The XP900 will be more nimble and more importantly parts are easy to get.   Dealers don't stock a lot of Wildcat parts.   

The Wildcat XX works find in Baja 500 type driving as well.  Just needs some help with the shock set up (springs and valving). 

 

 

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35 minutes ago, Sand Shark said:

The Wildcat X would still be my last choice for dirt or trail riding just from a reliability stand point.  You are not gaining much going from a XP900 to a Wildcat X for trail and dirt riding.  The XP900 will be more nimble and more importantly parts are easy to get.   Dealers don't stock a lot of Wildcat parts.   

The Wildcat XX works find in Baja 500 type driving as well.  Just needs some help with the shock set up (springs and valving). 

 

 

It's obvious you don't like the Wildcat X, and that's OK.

But don't say stuff like you can't get parts at the dealer. Maybe not at the Polaris or Canam dealer, but you still can at the Arctic Cat/Textron dealers and online as well, including Ebay. 

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1 hour ago, Sand Shark said:

The Wildcat XX would not be my choice for a car you want to play with in the rocks.  The overhang off the back is just asking to be hit when coming down or going up steep rocks. 

If it were me I would be looking at either the Polaris XP1000 rock edition ( or the 120hp Can Am 64" wide RC.   Both come with 30" tires and winches.  Better skid plates also.   The Polaris has 55% lower gearing

 

https://rzr.polaris.com/en-us/rzr-xp-1000-eps-trails-rocks-edition/

 

https://can-am.brp.com/off-road/side-by-side/maverick-x3/maverick-x3-x-rc-turbo.html

 

I would not dump any more money into the XP900.   Throwing long travel on to it or doing shock work is not going to improve the short wheelbase and the car still will not ride as nice as the XP1000 or X3 RC.  

Interesting vehicles. I would not want a rock crawler. Most of our stuff will be open desert and washes and also Jeep roads and back mountain roads up north. Might get it into low gear and rock crawl it in certain areas but that would be limited.

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35 minutes ago, socaldmax said:

It's obvious you don't like the Wildcat X, and that's OK.

But don't say stuff like you can't get parts at the dealer. Maybe not at the Polaris or Canam dealer, but you still can at the Arctic Cat/Textron dealers and online as well, including Ebay. 

I liked the Wildcat X and almost bought one.  However after seeing how they hold up I would advise anyone against buying one.  There are a lot better SXSs available that are also a lot more reliable.  The OP was looking for an upgrade and the Wildcat X is not an upgrade to the XP900.

You can get a new XP1000 new for under 17k and it would be a good upgrade to the XP1000.  

i did not say you can’t get parts.  The dealers don’t stock a lot of parts for the Wildcat or Wildcat X.  

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1 hour ago, onanysunday said:

Interesting vehicles. I would not want a rock crawler. Most of our stuff will be open desert and washes and also Jeep roads and back mountain roads up north. Might get it into low gear and rock crawl it in certain areas but that would be limited.

 The XP1000 is a great choice.  They can be had for good prices new.  Even the turbo XP with walker evans shocks you can get for under 20k.

The X3 there are some deals.  The 120hp models are around 20k.

The Texteon Wildcat XX would be an excellent choice for the riding you described.  

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7 hours ago, Sand Shark said:

 The XP1000 is a great choice.  They can be had for good prices new.  Even the turbo XP with walker evans shocks you can get for under 20k.

The X3 there are some deals.  The 120hp models are around 20k.

The Texteon Wildcat XX would be an excellent choice for the riding you described.  

A used 1000 with 1100 miles like this seems reasonable. https://phoenix.craigslist.org/wvl/snw/d/sun-city-2015-polaris-rzr-xp1000-eps/6748395806.html  Would not cost much to sell mine and upgrade. Read quite a bit on the Wildcat XX and if I bought one would want to do the shock therapy valving and sway bars. Would need to check a price on that and figure in the budget. Not keen on the screaming high rpm of that engine all of the time. I wear earplugs and my rugged headset in the buggy which drowns out all of the engine noise so I could do the same setup.  I do like that Justin said after many miles prerunning baja everything was still tight. If you watch his outtakes it sounds like other cars are loose and wore out running at those speeds. I really don't mind the extra weight to gain the  reliabilty. The guys back east that did the 3 part review did some drag races and the car still looked respectable. My 900 would be faster and probably run close to the newer heavier turbo 1000s. Certainly giving up performance with a car having only 5 more HP and 500lbs more weight. That is a lot.  But with much better suspension I assume I could run much faster in the desert.  They did beat the Wildcat xx up pretty bad due to bottoming a huge jump but I really don't need to jump big like that. I bet Justin has some magic to make this thing awesome in the desert. Was in the garage tonight measuring and the Wildcat is 26" longer than my 900! Seems so much bigger. :sha: The wheelbase is 14" longer. 81" to 95". A 2015 XP1000 has a 90" wheelbase. Not sure if that changed in later years.

 

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9 hours ago, onanysunday said:

A used 1000 with 1100 miles like this seems reasonable. https://phoenix.craigslist.org/wvl/snw/d/sun-city-2015-polaris-rzr-xp1000-eps/6748395806.html  Would not cost much to sell mine and upgrade. Read quite a bit on the Wildcat XX and if I bought one would want to do the shock therapy valving and sway bars. Would need to check a price on that and figure in the budget. Not keen on the screaming high rpm of that engine all of the time. I wear earplugs and my rugged headset in the buggy which drowns out all of the engine noise so I could do the same setup.  I do like that Justin said after many miles prerunning baja everything was still tight. If you watch his outtakes it sounds like other cars are loose and wore out running at those speeds. I really don't mind the extra weight to gain the  reliabilty. The guys back east that did the 3 part review did some drag races and the car still looked respectable. My 900 would be faster and probably run close to the newer heavier turbo 1000s. Certainly giving up performance with a car having only 5 more HP and 500lbs more weight. That is a lot.  But with much better suspension I assume I could run much faster in the desert.  They did beat the Wildcat xx up pretty bad due to bottoming a huge jump but I really don't need to jump big like that. I bet Justin has some magic to make this thing awesome in the desert. Was in the garage tonight measuring and the Wildcat is 26" longer than my 900! Seems so much bigger. :sha: The wheelbase is 14" longer. 81" to 95". A 2015 XP1000 has a 90" wheelbase. Not sure if that changed in later years.

 

That XP1000  is priced a little high considering it does not have much on it.   You can price out a new one for not much more.    I sold my XP1000 for $15,000 with a cage, seats, lights, radio/intercom, doors and some other extras over a year ago.  My car had a lot more miles than the one you linked.  Mine had 5500 miles on it. 

The Wildcat XX motor/exhaust sound is not bad in stock form .  It does not scream like the YXZ as it has to be tuned different for the CVT set up.   I road with a Wildcat XX in Baja over the summer and that thing took a beating.   The owner missed a turn and flew off a small cliff  and landed a good 50' down the embankment from the road.  The car amazingly landed on all 4 wheels and he drove it through some cactus  and bushes and managed to get back on the road.   The damage to the car was minimal other than a dimple in the frame where he must of smacked a rock.    I would like to drive one with the Shock Therapy work.  In stock form the suspension set up is not great once you start getting mildly aggressive.    The Wildcat XX is a really nice SXS and there was a lot of thought put into the design.  I love that the bed area can handle up to a 32" tire.  I like that the car is pre-wired for accessories.   

From what I have seen and read there really are no belt issues with the Wildcat XX.   There were some axle issues with the first round, but that seems to be sorted out.  

There were 2 Wildcat XXs in our group this past week in Glamis.  Neither owner had any complaints or issues to complain about.  

I don't think you would be disappointed in the Wildcat XX for your intended use.  Even in the dunes it will scoot around fine, 

The wheelbase on the XP1000 has always been 90".   For you jumping into a newer SXS with the longer wheelbase will be a huge improvement.  Way more stable than your 900.  Your 900 gets sketchy when you get up to 60+.   My XP1000 was solid to 75ish and then it started to get a little sketchy.  My X3 with the 102" wheelbase feels planted up to 90mph.   

Another nice thing is you can run a bigger tires on the XP1000 or Wildcat XX.   I ran a 31" ITP Ultracross on my XP1000 and I felt it was the perfect tire size for the car in the desert and trails.  The Wildcat XX will handle up to a 32" tire. 

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I recently sold my 2015 XP1000 for $13,500 with Cagewerx cage, harnesses, radios, 30in mongrels on Method beadlocks ,etc. and had 1500 miles. Would have been perfect for you. The market is saturated with them and pricing is dropping monthly. 

I wouldn't spend the money on the 900 as those are depreciating faster than the 1000's

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I will say after reading a bunch over on the Wildcat forum the CV boot issues, axles, needing to upgrade the rear suspension, etc has me a little worried about a first year car.  A new one is going to push the budget and a used one probably would be hard to get warranty work done? What about the Yamaha YXZ? Don't know much about it other than I remember hearing they were not good for slow rock crawling and needed some clutch work? Sounds like it is the same engine as the XX.  300+ pounds lighter at just over 1500 lbs.

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The more I think about it the more I don't want to step way down in power. I am a speed junkie for sure. My car runs really good.  (1324 lbs with 120 turbo hp)  So a buddy of mine I ride side by sides with told me today that the 2017-2018 xpt 1000s had a lot of changes from 2016. 168hp up from 144hp with larger radiator behind the intercooler. Better belt setup. Stronger cases and axles. Bigger brakes.  Only 1495 lbs.  Something like THIS  could work. Perfect upgrades with cage and shocks. I don't need or want much more. Can't tell but maybe just harnesses. I would still need to sell my car first since I don't have space for two cars. From looking around I think my car is worth $11-$11.5k.  An $8k-$9k swing wouldn't be to bad. https://dirtwheelsmag.com/utv-test-2017-polaris-rzr-xp-turbo/  Plus I could dune this car if the buggy was broke down. (Nice option)  The one thing I have not researched yet is to see if there are any Can Ams at the $20k price point. 

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Oh and did Polaris fix the fire problems in 2017?

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23 minutes ago, onanysunday said:

The more I think about it the more I don't want to step way down in power. I am a speed junkie for sure. My car runs really good.  (1324 lbs with 120 turbo hp)  So a buddy of mine I ride side by sides with told me today that the 2017-2018 xpt 1000s had a lot of changes from 2016. 168hp up from 144hp with larger radiator behind the intercooler. Better belt setup. Stronger cases and axles. Bigger brakes.  Only 1495 lbs.  Something like THIS  could work. Perfect upgrades with cage and shocks. I don't need or want much more. Can't tell but maybe just harnesses. I would still need to sell my car first since I don't have space for two cars. From looking around I think my car is worth $11-$11.5k.  An $8k-$9k swing wouldn't be to bad. https://dirtwheelsmag.com/utv-test-2017-polaris-rzr-xp-turbo/  Plus I could dune this car if the buggy was broke down. (Nice option)  The one thing I have not researched yet is to see if there are any Can Ams at the $20k price point. 

2017 and newer XP Turbos are solid cars.  If you go  that route  get the model with the internal bypass Fox. Shock.  Or you could really step up and get a Turbo S which is 72” wide and comes with 32” tires.  Turbo S dynamic suspension set up is really really good.  Turbo S you don’t have to do anything after purchase as it comes with everything.  

Can Am X3 in the 20k range is going to be a base model or maybe a DS model.  

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my choice

imagesNQJNC7X8.jpg

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10 hours ago, J Alper said:

my choice

imagesNQJNC7X8.jpg

Those are cute and excellent in most mall parking lots.  LOL!!    Jeeps are great until you get to the open desert in rougher stuff.  They beat you up whereas a SXS can get through much smoother.   

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my 18 turbo rzr was 18k otd (oregon) including an aluminum roof and polaris windshield. spring kit for $700 and it's a decent ride. i put stg 4 tune/exhaust/clutch and it's just over 200hp at the crank. it's pretty quick. it's really fast on dirt/asphalt, lol.

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29 minutes ago, mark5193 said:

my 18 turbo rzr was 18k otd (oregon) including an aluminum roof and polaris windshield. spring kit for $700 and it's a decent ride. i put stg 4 tune/exhaust/clutch and it's just over 200hp at the crank. it's pretty quick. it's really fast on dirt/asphalt, lol.

Iron City who I would far prefer over Ride now has one 18 left and it is $19,550 otd. Ride now does not have any 18s and a 19 is more money. Add a cage and harnesses and it gets up over $21,500 for the Iron City car. I want to keep the budget at $20k.

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To bad they are so far away in Tennessee.  Abernathy's is the largest Polaris dealer in the US and for the month of January you can buy either a white and orange or Titanium 2019 model for $17,246 plus $54 OTD.  

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When you sell your 900 your going to need to market it more towards the Showlow or Flagstaff type of market to get the best bang for your buck.  If you try and sell in the metro area they are not going to pay what your thinking.

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