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Jonesin'

2" Hollows

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Yes we take your spindle and modify them to a 2” hollow.  If you look at the thread we started a couple of years ago there is about 4 pages of spindles we did. We also have a cnc that we can add gussets to if we want to modify any part of your spindle.  

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6 hours ago, J Alper said:

the thread we started a couple of years ago there is about 4 pages of spindles we did.   

Do you have a link to that thread by chance?

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On 1/3/2019 at 3:10 AM, J Alper said:

The only real issue with king Kong’s is you really don’t gain any real strength 

the mai reason why is the mounting area 

the weld mounting area is almost the same on the snout so you might not break the snout but the weld cracks over time and can fail. 

Tipically the 2” hollow has 4.3 times the weld area and does not fail 

in my opinion Heims snouts and steering boxes you do not pinch pennies on. 

I’m still trying to see how you get 4.3 times the weld area on a 2” hollow compared to a King Kong. 

If you could post the weld area diameter for the Combo, King Kong and 2” hollow, I would be happy to do the math. 

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you take pie 3.14 times the circumference, so for a spindle you take the circumference on the inside and the outside,

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44 minutes ago, J Alper said:

you take pie 3.14 times the circumference, so for a spindle you take the circumference on the inside and the outside,

That’s not correct.  The circumference of a circle equals the diameter times 3.14 (Pi).  Not the circumference times 3.14 as you stated.  The circumference is the perimeter of a circle, so now I can see how you got a much bigger number when you multiply the circumference times Pi (3.14).

So if you can post the inside and the outside weld diameter for the Combo, King Kong, and 2” hollows, I would by happy to do the math.

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30 minutes ago, Flip-Flop said:

That’s not correct.  The circumference of a circle equals the diameter times 3.14 (Pi).  Not the circumference times 3.14 as you stated.  The circumference is the perimeter of a circle, so now I can see how you got a much bigger number when you multiply the circumference times Pi (3.14).

So if you can post the inside and the outside weld diameter for the Combo, King Kong, and 2” hollows, I would by happy to do the math.

2'' hollow inside hole is 2.750 outside weld is 3.650 ouside

combo is inside 1.5'' outside is 2''

king kong inside is 1.5'' outside is 2.5''

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so if I did it correctly now,

a combo has a total of 4.27'' of weld inside and out together

a king kong total of weld is 4.89''

and a 2' hollow should have 12.80'' of weld inside and out,

with the Diameter listed in the above post it would be interesting to see what the load difference is on leverage from the combo to the 2'' hollow

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58 minutes ago, Flip-Flop said:

That’s not correct.  The circumference of a circle equals the diameter times 3.14 (Pi).  Not the circumference times 3.14 as you stated.  The circumference is the perimeter of a circle, so now I can see how you got a much bigger number when you multiply the circumference times Pi (3.14).

So if you can post the inside and the outside weld diameter for the Combo, King Kong, and 2” hollows, I would by happy to do the math.

sorry Flip-Flop I did mean TT times the diameter,  just went back and read my post.Can you calc out the leverage difference in the spindles

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54 minutes ago, J Alper said:

so if I did it correctly now,

a combo has a total of 4.27'' of weld inside and out together

a king kong total of weld is 4.89''

and a 2' hollow should have 12.80'' of weld inside and out,

with the Diameter listed in the above post it would be interesting to see what the load difference is on leverage from the combo to the 2'' hollow

I got different numbers.  If I understood your previous post each one has 2 weld circles.  So you would find the circumference of each weld circle and then add them together. Not sure if the inner weld circle on the combo and King Kong have the same diameter at 1.5”, maybe a typo?   Not sure if that’s right, but if that is correct here are my results.

Combo - 1.5 x 3.14 = 4.71 plus 2 x 3.14 = 6.28 for a total weld area of 10.99 inches.

King Kong - 1.5 x 3.14 = 4.71 plus 2.5 x 3.14 = 7.85 for a total weld area of 12.56 inches.

2” Hollow - 2.75 x  3.14 = 8.64 plus 3.65 x 3.14 = 11.46 for a total weld area of 20.1 inches.

That would give the 2” Hollow 1.6 times the King Kong and 1.83 times the Combo in a welded surface area.

Also the King Kong has 1.14 times the Combo in a welded surface area.

 

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2 hours ago, Flip-Flop said:

I got different numbers.  If I understood your previous post each one has 2 weld circles.  So you would find the circumference of each weld circle and then add them together. Not sure if the inner weld circle on the combo and King Kong have the same diameter at 1.5”, maybe a typo?   Not sure if that’s right, but if that is correct here are my results.

Combo - 1.5 x 3.14 = 4.71 plus 2 x 3.14 = 6.28 for a total weld area of 10.99 inches.

King Kong - 1.5 x 3.14 = 4.71 plus 2.5 x 3.14 = 7.85 for a total weld area of 12.56 inches.

2” Hollow - 2.75 x  3.14 = 8.64 plus 3.65 x 3.14 = 11.46 for a total weld area of 20.1 inches.

That would give the 2” Hollow 1.6 times the King Kong and 1.83 times the Combo in a welded surface area.

Also the King Kong has 1.14 times the Combo in a welded surface area.

 

 

but the other part to consider is the 20 is almost 40'', on a combo or a king kong  you can only do a single root pass on a weld due to the part being over stressed by the heat, on a hollow you can do a root pass inner and outer and then walk the cup on the outside to do a double pass, most hollows are a double pass tig  on the outside, and a Mig you run around 185 wire speed and on a 2'' hollow you can run 400, and the amps can double,

in the math is correct for the measurement of the circles but still think you get 3-4 times the weld on the part,

still would be nice to know what the difference in leverage would be, Damn I used a online calculator, and did not do the normal math I feel little foolish, LOL

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4 hours ago, J Alper said:

 

but the other part to consider is the 20 is almost 40'', on a combo or a king kong  you can only do a single root pass on a weld due to the part being over stressed by the heat, on a hollow you can do a root pass inner and outer and then walk the cup on the outside to do a double pass, most hollows are a double pass tig  on the outside, and a Mig you run around 185 wire speed and on a 2'' hollow you can run 400, and the amps can double,

in the math is correct for the measurement of the circles but still think you get 3-4 times the weld on the part,

still would be nice to know what the difference in leverage would be, Damn I used a online calculator, and did not do the normal math I feel little foolish, LOL

 I wouldn’t know a single root pass on a weld if it hit me in the face.  However, my grandson is taking welding classes in college, so some day he may able to show me one.

I learned something from our discussion in this thread and I’m sure others have as well.  It’s always beneficial to have a good explanation and data to substantiate the reasons for a claim and I think you have done that. Thanks.

 

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Combos should be welded over a hole so you can weld the inside and the outside. If done right then they don’t fall off. The plate that the spindle or hollow is welded too can break off the rest of the spindle.  The whole spindle and not just the stub or hollow takes a beating on all cars. Here is combo that broke in right front of me Thursday  that was made right and was beaten for 10 seasons with 10.50x15 STU 3 rib. 4 seat LS car that hauls ass with a fast driver. I’ve heard that if they get too hot during the weld they break like this or that there was a small run of combos and a lot of them broke in the same place along the step. In this case it was just run hard for a decade with a big azz tire on it. You can see it was cracked for a while. It got run over by the back tire and did not bounce up  but trust me if you see a wheel come off crank the wheel and get away from that bouncy mofo before it hits you in the face.

BAD8596F-C4C9-409A-B2BD-5AF7EB753E9F.thumb.jpeg.f75f2cd4bbf4fdf619533c28bb779727.jpeg3A4EACDE-2792-4CC6-B025-49D1AAB05487.thumb.jpeg.92c4be57b0e32053e836beaf9c45df01.jpeg

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13 hours ago, Flip-Flop said:

 I wouldn’t know a single root pass on a weld if it hit me in the face.  However, my grandson is taking welding classes in college, so some day he may able to show me one.

I learned something from our discussion in this thread and I’m sure others have as well.  It’s always beneficial to have a good explanation and data to substantiate the reasons for a claim and I think you have done that. Thanks.

 

Me also thanks for the help flip flop,

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3 hours ago, stumpalump said:

Combos should be welded over a hole so you can weld the inside and the outside. If done right then they don’t fall off. The plate that the spindle or hollow is welded too can break off the rest of the spindle.  The whole spindle and not just the stub or hollow takes a beating on all cars. Here is combo that broke in right front of me Thursday  that was made right and was beaten for 10 seasons with 10.50x15 STU 3 rib. 4 seat LS car that hauls ass with a fast driver. I’ve heard that if they get too hot during the weld they break like this or that there was a small run of combos and a lot of them broke in the same place along the step. In this case it was just run hard for a decade with a big azz tire on it. You can see it was cracked for a while. It got run over by the back tire and did not bounce up  but trust me if you see a wheel come off crank the wheel and get away from that bouncy mofo before it hits you in the face.

BAD8596F-C4C9-409A-B2BD-5AF7EB753E9F.thumb.jpeg.f75f2cd4bbf4fdf619533c28bb779727.jpeg3A4EACDE-2792-4CC6-B025-49D1AAB05487.thumb.jpeg.92c4be57b0e32053e836beaf9c45df01.jpeg

that is a Kartek spindle mine had some top notch welding and broke around the same spot when I went to the 10.75 x 15 wheels,

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For informational purposes combo weight VS. 2" hollow and then there is the addition weight of the bigger tire to consider. I went from a 8.50 to a 10.75 and although I did not weight it the 10.75 is probably 10 lbs heavier.

 

 

 

20180722_143740.jpg

20180722_143653.jpg

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that is good info not much difference in the weight, but allot of strength added per pound

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Yup, I'll be shipping my spindles off to Alper as soon as I can

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On 1/12/2019 at 11:37 AM, stumpalump said:

Combos should be welded over a hole so you can weld the inside and the outside. If done right then they don’t fall off. The plate that the spindle or hollow is welded too can break off the rest of the spindle.  The whole spindle and not just the stub or hollow takes a beating on all cars. Here is combo that broke in right front of me Thursday  that was made right and was beaten for 10 seasons with 10.50x15 STU 3 rib. 4 seat LS car that hauls ass with a fast driver. I’ve heard that if they get too hot during the weld they break like this or that there was a small run of combos and a lot of them broke in the same place along the step. In this case it was just run hard for a decade with a big azz tire on it. You can see it was cracked for a while. It got run over by the back tire and did not bounce up  but trust me if you see a wheel come off crank the wheel and get away from that bouncy mofo before it hits you in the face.

BAD8596F-C4C9-409A-B2BD-5AF7EB753E9F.thumb.jpeg.f75f2cd4bbf4fdf619533c28bb779727.jpeg3A4EACDE-2792-4CC6-B025-49D1AAB05487.thumb.jpeg.92c4be57b0e32053e836beaf9c45df01.jpeg

Has anyone seen a King Kong break similar to the Combo pictured here?

Not break or come apart at the weld. I know that has already been discussed in this and other threads. 

But actually break or crack the solid metal. 

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Yep happened to me over thanksgiving on my King Kong spindles. Welds were fine but the actual spindle sheared. This was on a 10.75 tire. 

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Does anyone know where the thread is where a member modified his spindles to 2'' hollow and then machined the hubs to fit the larger spindle and bearing? If so please send me a link or info.

Thanks

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25 minutes ago, ridetime said:

Does anyone know where the thread is where a member modified his spindles to 2'' hollow and then machined the hubs to fit the larger spindle and bearing? If so please send me a link or info.

Thanks

@J Alper may know o that thread

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3 hours ago, Jonesin' said:

@J Alper may know o that thread

It not possible the combo/kong hub is 2” two skinny and not enough material 

think you are thinking of the king to Kong conversion 

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17 hours ago, racedezert said:

Yep happened to me over thanksgiving on my King Kong spindles. Welds were fine but the actual spindle sheared. This was on a 10.75 tire. 

Thanks.  Do you have any more info that you can share?  For example how heavy is your car, driving style; do you jump it, wheelie, pound the whoops,  do the desert or sand only, etc. ?   What happened when it broke, were you just cruising along, hit a witch's eye or ???

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7 minutes ago, Flip-Flop said:

Thanks.  Do you have any more info that you can share?  For example how heavy is your car, driving style; do you jump it, wheelie, pound the whoops,  do the desert or sand only, etc. ?   What happened when it broke, were you just cruising along, hit a witch's eye or ???

Car is a Weurth, guessing weight is around 2200lbs, not a very heavy car.  Ive only had it for 2 years so don't know previous driving style or conditions.  I do sand only with a family and kids in the back.  No jumping or pounding woops.  It broke right outside of camp shifting from 2nd to 3rd gear.  Was just a matter of time I guess and that's when it let go.  Glad it let go when and where it happened.  3 wheeled back to camp and took to Joe fab and he welded a new king kong on the spindle and after the trip tore it down and sent to Alper for 2" upgrade.  Much better piece of mind now.

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