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jhuerta

Welding location for shock tube advise

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Hello guys,

Im considering moving the shock mounts away from the chassis so that they line up in a more direct up and down motion. My original plan was to weld a tube that will overlap 50% for both tubes there they weld up. This way the new tub will add strength to that intersection.  Similar to the red circle. Or should I just weld up directly to my outer cage tube like on the green circle.  Please ignore the bent tube that I am using as a sample mock-up. I only using that for demonstration purposes.   

Im not sure if it normal to overlap welds like that. 

 

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Edited by jhuerta

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either way would work. if you can tie the new tube into the old shock mount tubing, that would really help add strength and shouldnt give you any issues down the road.

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At full bump your shocks should be at a 90* to the top of your trailing arm. 

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3 minutes ago, cali kid said:

At full bump your shocks should be at a 90* to the top of your trailing arm. 

This is another interesting topic also. I am planning to place mine at 90 or 87 for safe measures but I have noticed within the last few years that some  cars shocks look like they are not at 90. Maybe they are but they sure dont seem like it.  Thanks cali kid. I will be working on that today on this rainy day!

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1 hour ago, jhuerta said:

This is another interesting topic also. I am planning to place mine at 90 or 87 for safe measures but I have noticed within the last few years that some  cars shocks look like they are not at 90. Maybe they are but they sure dont seem like it.  Thanks cali kid. I will be working on that today on this rainy day!

Maybe some experts will chime in but this is what I know from learning from some builders. I appreciate people working on their own cars looks like fun!

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Why are you even moving them? The cars work well and the suspension works. I’ve had one and it was a good little car. 

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1 hour ago, cek said:

Why are you even moving them? The cars work well and the suspension works. I’ve had one and it was a good little car. 

I was wondering too. I don't think having the shock straight'er up and down is going to improve anything. Are you going longer for more travel? Going with longer shocks? 

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On 2/2/2019 at 10:36 AM, cek said:

Why are you even moving them? The cars work well and the suspension works. I’ve had one and it was a good little car. 

Well, My family and I went out the desert on a day trip not too long ago and this happened again.  The actual top part of the shock broke which leaked out the oil and the rod snapped again.  The original owner of the car had the arms on this particular car built wider than the normal ones.  The builder of the car not the owner told me himself before he passed away. That's why I want to change the mounts.  It was a long day getting the car on the trailer. I didn't take all my tools that day not even a jack! Never again will I go anywhere without a jack! Lesson learned the hard way. On a good note the transmission did great! 👍

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Bummer man! Post some pics of the mounting of the rear shock. Is it possible the tire is rubbing the shock at full compression and causing a side load? I have seen a few sway away shocks break shafts but not bodies...

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I think some more side pics will help,

on my DD car it took some time to get it correct, I would start with paper, then sheetmetal   after you get it with sheet metal then pretty easy to transfer it to .125 plate,

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8 hours ago, jhuerta said:

Well, My family and I went out the desert on a day trip not too long ago and this happened again.  The actual top part of the shock broke which leaked out the oil and the rod snapped again.  The original owner of the car had the arms on this particular car built wider than the normal ones.  The builder of the car not the owner told me himself before he passed away. That's why I want to change the mounts.  It was a long day getting the car on the trailer. I didn't take all my tools that day not even a jack! Never again will I go anywhere without a jack! Lesson learned the hard way. On a good note the transmission did great! 👍

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That really sux. If it was me I would have new “stock arms built” assuming that was the only thing he changed. . No sense in trying re engineer something that already works. Why did he have new arms built? 

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I was on it! I had the gas pedal to the floor. I figured if its going to break it will right now. It did good for the enter day until the infamous last run! I think the original owner took it really easy so he never experience any issues.  Either way I had a blast cursing the desert with it. It climb up all the hills at Hodge road. The transmission ran great the motor sound good. I just think the the top shock mounts are too inward causing the lower and top mount to be more parallel than perpendicular so it snapped. After I'm done it will should be okay. I think i can fix it by Presidents  day weekend. I will post some pictures later. 

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1 hour ago, jhuerta said:

I was on it! I had the gas pedal to the floor. I figured if its going to break it will right now. It did good for the enter day until the infamous last run! I think the original owner took it really easy so he never experience any issues.  Either way I had a blast cursing the desert with it. It climb up all the hills at Hodge road. The transmission ran great the motor sound good. I just think the the top shock mounts are too inward causing the lower and top mount to be more parallel than perpendicular so it snapped. After I'm done it will should be okay. I think i can fix it by Presidents  day weekend. I will post some pictures later. 

Would it be easier to move the mounts on the trailing arm  ?

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personally i feel you have more of a shock issue than mounts. sway a way shock shafts are not a high quality shaft (known to pit/rust). 

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4 hours ago, Dune Marshall said:

Would it be easier to move the mounts on the trailing arm  ?

Not really I dont have too much room on the arm. I l ready got started. This weekend I will weld on the mounts. 

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I already cut the shock mounts and started to work on the new location. The new location will work out good. I was worried for a bit because I wasn't sure I was going to be 90deg or below at full bump but im good. I will take a few more on Saturday. 

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For perspective I added this picture so I can try to explain what happened.  The green is a crack that went pretty much all the way around except in the back. The blue is where the top shock mount wedged into the eyelet.  The eyelet would have pretty much broke off completely with some effort. 

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Not sure what your plans are mounting it to the tube , but they should be double shear mounted . If your not planning on it . 

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I made mine out of plate to push it out and get double sheer. Is the car bottoming out the shock consistently causing the failures?

 

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Edited by punkur67

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On 2/8/2019 at 7:43 AM, jhuerta said:

I was on it! I had the gas pedal to the floor. I figured if its going to break it will right now. It did good for the enter day until the infamous last run! I think the original owner took it really easy so he never experience any issues.  Either way I had a blast cursing the desert with it. It climb up all the hills at Hodge road. The transmission ran great the motor sound good. I just think the the top shock mounts are too inward causing the lower and top mount to be more parallel than perpendicular so it snapped. After I'm done it will should be okay. I think i can fix it by Presidents  day weekend. I will post some pictures later. 

Finally got my pictures to load

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On 2/9/2019 at 7:49 PM, punkur67 said:

 

I made mine out of plate to push it out and get double sheer. Is the car bottoming out the shock consistently causing the failures?

 

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That came out really good. Thanks for the pics 

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Well I think I found out what my issue was. Unfortunately I made more work for myself since the geometry was not that bad but I did adjust the shock mount a bit further out and a different angle so the time was not completely a waste. The issue was the original 12 inch shock was too small. I will post some pictures later Im going to try an finish it tonight so it can be ready for the Presidents weekend. 

After analyzing the geometry of the shock and full droop and full bump I come to realized that my 12 inch shock was too short. What was happening is that when the arm would go beyond that I think is full bump (1 inch before the chassis hits the ground) the angle of the shock would cause it to bind and snap. Now i got some 14 and they are perfect in the sense that they will stop my car about 1/2 beyond what I want full bump to be(I figure I add a taller rubber bumps to the shaft) but I am not using the full travel of the shock its like 2  1/2 inches too long.  With the 14 inch shocks are full bump there is some free play so everything is good.   I went yesterday to Kartek to by some bypass and they said I should put bump stops to stop the car and not rely on the shocks and bypass.  So I got some fox bump stops but after read some post here and I think I should just by some bypass. Im planing to head back to Kartek and return the bumps and buy bybass. 

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8 hours ago, jhuerta said:

Well I think I found out what my issue was. Unfortunately I made more work for myself since the geometry was not that bad but I did adjust the shock mount a bit further out and a different angle so the time was not completely a waste. The issue was the original 12 inch shock was too small. I will post some pictures later Im going to try an finish it tonight so it can be ready for the Presidents weekend. 

After analyzing the geometry of the shock and full droop and full bump I come to realized that my 12 inch shock was too short. What was happening is that when the arm would go beyond that I think is full bump (1 inch before the chassis hits the ground) the angle of the shock would cause it to bind and snap. Now i got some 14 and they are perfect in the sense that they will stop my car about 1/2 beyond what I want full bump to be(I figure I add a taller rubber bumps to the shaft) but I am not using the full travel of the shock its like 2  1/2 inches too long.  With the 14 inch shocks are full bump there is some free play so everything is good.   I went yesterday to Kartek to by some bypass and they said I should put bump stops to stop the car and not rely on the shocks and bypass.  So I got some fox bump stops but after read some post here and I think I should just by some bypass. Im planing to head back to Kartek and return the bumps and buy bybass. 

If you’re trusting the hard rubber snubber to protect you from bottom out, then I agree: shit will eventually fail. If you have a progressive rate stop, I think it’d be all right. The shock is holding up the car 99% of the time after all.  As long as there isn’t any leverage on the shock at full bump, it shouldn’t fail. 

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Food for thought . Going to 14 inch coil over from 12 . Depending on motio ratio . I think that’s what it is called . Your  2 inch longer collapsed length may equal 4 inches or so of up travel susp .

Extended coil over length approx 4 inch longer . You may need. Limit straps . Cause your CV angle may be limiting factor 

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The girls said shocks look good! I told them then work good too! 

On a serious note.  Me and son hit some jumps and they where so soft. I did bottom that much! 2 times at the most. I need to look at the video to see how these shocks work. 

 

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